Proof of Citizenship

[Rhodes]

I have recently put in my application for permanent residence of Canada. My wife is Canadian, so my application will be rushed through within 6 months. (Sorry to all of you have been waiting for ages...! )

Anyway, we have two children, one of three, nearly four, and the other is coming up to a year. They were born in England, but are automatically Canadian citizens, as my wife is Canadian. We have read in various places conflicting information about how long it will take for us to get proof of Canadian citizenship documents for the children. The www.cic.gc.ca website says ‘within 3 months’, but I have seen in other official sites ‘6-9 months’ and ‘12-15’ months. Their Canadian passports will arrive within a few weeks, apparently.

We’d like to go to Canada well in time for Christmas, and probably in October or November. Does anyone happen to know whether we need to get the proof of citizenship certificates before we arrive in Canada, or whether we could have them sent to where we’ll be living (with my wife’s parents)? Both children have British passports, if that makes any difference…

Thanks for any help!

[Kayalami]

I am somewhat confused by your Q. You would need to enclose proof of Canadian Citizenship in the application for your children's Canadian passports. Under the Canadian Passport order the proof of citizenship is:

1. Birth Certificate issued in a Canadian Province or Territory - if it is from Quebec then it must have been issued on or after 1 January 1994.

2. Citizenship Certificate.

3. Certificate of Naturalisation.

1 & 3 don't apply to your kids. They would have to get 2. This inolves filling out Form CIT 0006 - Application for Citizenship Certificate from Outside Canada. The key evidence will be your wife's proof of Canadian citizenship either 1 or 2. The CHC in London will give you the processing times for this as the forms have to be sent back to the Citizenship Office in Nova Scotia, Canada. However generally speaking immigration related processing takes longer in the summer months due to more travellers and staff taking vacation time off so you want to get the applications in quick.

Or are you saying the CHC accepted an application for passport facilities for your kids without the Citizenship Certificate?

Shouldn't be a problem getting to Canada in October-December if the Citizenship Certificates and thus Canadian Passports haven't materialised (unlikely). Your kids can enter Canada on their British Passports - just explain the situation to the immigration officer. You can change your address on e-client to that in Canada once you land - hopefully the certificates won't be on their way back to London .

[Rhodes]

Cheers, Kayalami. The bit of the jigsaw I missed out was that my wife was told by the Canadian High Commission in London that we ought to apply for both the passport and proof of citizenship at the same time, but that the passport would arrive quite some time in advance of the proof of citizenship. One option might, I suppose, be to use a Canadian mailing address for the proof of citizenship, if we can.

In the application pack for the passport, there is a little slip of paper to fill in when one doesn't have a Canadian birth certificate or certificate of Canadian citizenship, and that has to be signed to say that "I understand that I may be issued with a limited validity passport for travel" and goes on to say that the passport will not be extended until the appropriate documentation (so, proof of citizenship in this case) has been issued.

I think that I (or perhaps Mrs Rhodes) will take the papers to Canada House and try to discuss is with them, espcially as I don't know what a limited validity passport means. I don't want it to expire before my application for prmanent residence is approved (probably in early October)!

This can get rather confusing!

[Kayalami]

Cheers, Kayalami. The bit of the jigsaw I missed out was that my wife was told by the Canadian High Commission in London that we ought to apply for both the passport and proof of citizenship at the same time, but that the passport would arrive quite some time in advance of the proof of citizenship. One option might, I suppose, be to use a Canadian mailing address for the proof of citizenship, if we can.

Interesting to see Canada House have accepted a dual passport/citizenship certificate application. The establishment of the children's canadian citizenship it seems will be communicated in advance from Nova Scotia (based on your wife's documents) to Canada House to initiate passport issuance. The physical production of a citizenship card will then take place afterwards. Not sure about the use of a Canadian mailing address if you are not physically in Canada - one to check with Canada House.

In the application pack for the passport, there is a little slip of paper to fill in when one doesn't have a Canadian birth certificate or certificate of Canadian citizenship, and that has to be signed to say that "I understand that I may be issued with a limited validity passport for travel" and goes on to say that the passport will not be extended until the appropriate documentation (so, proof of citizenship in this case) has been issued.

I think that I (or perhaps Mrs Rhodes) will take the papers to Canada House and try to discuss is with them, espcially as I don't know what a limited validity passport means. I don't want it to expire before my application for prmanent residence is approved (probably in early October)!

Restricted validity passports routinely tend to be for 1 year as opposed to the standard 5 years. You should be ok on this front. It is definitley helpful if Mrs Rhodes made the enquiries or accompanied you for such.

This can get rather confusing!

Appreciate the process can be somewhat stressful. Perhaps it will help if you think of it as the start of or rather a continuation of your love affair with Canada and all things Canadian

[Rhodes]

Well, they haven't actually accepted the applications yet: we hope to get them in over the next day or two. But that is certainly what Mrs R was told, and the slip of paper I referred to, for those who don't have a certificate showing that they are citizens would certainly suggest that that is right. I do hope so!

Thanks for the info on the restricted passport. That is good news, though we will confirm with them just to be absoluitely sure.

My love afffair with Canada began in July 1996 when I met my wife. I am not going to be put off by a bunch of civil servants who find it difficult to explain themselves clearly or who contradict themselves. I am a civil servant myself, so I know what it is like!

[Rhodes]

By way of an update:

Mrs Rhodes has spoken to the people at Canada House. It is indeed perfectly all right to put in applications for passport and certificates of citizenship for both our boys at the same time. The passports will take about 5 weeks to arrive. They will be restricted, and that does, as Kayalami said, mean that they'll be valid for one year.

It is also possible to put a Canadian address in the box on the proof of citizenship forms, so they wil be sent there when they're ready. That is currently taking 'about a year'. In the unlikely event that they arrive before we go to Canada, we can get Mrs Rhodes's parents (whose address we'll put on the form) to send them to us. Either way, the chap at Canada House assured Mrs Rhodes that it was nothing to worry about.

[Kayalami]

Good to hear things worked out and Canada House were helpful - unusual to get anywhere with info seeking be it the civil service (try contacting the UK Home Office) or financial institutions.....fancy calling your bank during lunch hour?

One other thing to be aware of - presume Mrs R has obtained her British Citizenship - if not it is worth doing so to save the hastle of future travel to the UK. There is a BC gent on the UK family immigration forum who emigrated to Japan with his BC son and Japanese wife who only held ILR then and they have decided to come back - she will have to through the rigmarole of getting her permanent residency visa re-issued. ILR is lost where there are absences of more than 2 years out of the UK - technical visits to the UK to maintain the status eventually fails. Had his wife been a BC she would have simply waltzed into the UK at her/ their convencience. We saw on the old board peoplewho got their BC application approved in a month - it seems that those where an oath is not required (basically those nationals where the Queen is still head of state including Canadians) get processed pronto.

Good luck with everything and best wishes for happy times in Canada.

Kayalami

[Rhodes]

Many thanks (rather belatedly!) Kayalami.

It seems that things might have changed with applying for British Citizenship. The Government website says:

Citizenship Ceremonies

Important changes have been made to the way that British citizenship is granted to people applying to register or naturalise.

Under the Nationality, Immigration and Asylum Act 2002 successful applicants will be expected to attend citizenship ceremonies. These will be held in their local communities.

All applications received on or after 1 January 2004 will be subject to these new arrangements.

If your application is successful you will be told where to go for your ceremony.

The heart of the citizenship ceremony will involve prospective citizens making an oath/affirmation to Her Majesty the Queen and a pledge of loyalty to the United Kingdom after which a certificate will be presented. Citizenship ceremonies will take place at a designated venue in a local authority area.

The process takes about 6 months, followed by the citizenship ceremony, which appears to be compulsory, even for people from within the Queen's patch, according to the above. As we hope to be in Canada by the end of the year, and preferably by October or November, I think we'll not bother with this. Especially as my wife would have to send her passport in, given her earlier difficulties with the deliberately unhelpful people in Croydon.

[Kayalami]

Many thanks (rather belatedly!) Kayalami.

Glad to be of help.

The process takes about 6 months, followed by the citizenship ceremony, which appears to be compulsory, even for people from within the Queen's patch, according to the above. As we hope to be in Canada by the end of the year, and preferably by October or November, I think we'll not bother with this. Especially as my wife would have to send her passport in, given her earlier difficulties with the deliberately unhelpful people in Croydon.

Although Mrs R would be exempt from the oath/affirmation she still needs to undertake the new pledge. Is there someone in the UK who can receive notification of the citizenship ceremony - this is where a good lawyer or family friends can prove quite useful? They can then update you accordingly and Mrs R can fly across to take the pledge. IMHO if Mrs R applied for naturalisation today she would be done and dusted by Dec 2004 subject to her meeting all the legislative requirements - the 6 months timeline you quote is an average rather than case specific.

[Rhodes]

I have plenty of trustworthy family in England, so that would be worth considering, I guess, though I think that Mrs R would be reluctant to send in her passport for several months, after her unhappy experience with Lunar House in Croydon. But thanks for the suggestions. I shall discuss with Mrs R.

[Kayalami]

though I think that Mrs R would be reluctant to send in her passport for several months, after her unhappy experience with Lunar House in Croydon.

Tssk Mr R. - the excitement must be getting to you. The Home Office Nationality department will accept notarised copies of all the pages in her passport/s covering the qualifying residential period. Get out the yellow pages, get quotes from the local solicitors - try get those who do a batch/fixed fee notarisation rather than fee per page..it can get expensive. Mrs R should then take her ppt to them - accompany her for the fun element...now now I hear you say since when does going to a solicitors involve fun .

Send the notarised pages off with the naturalisation application. Sit back and wait for the citizenship ceremony date - in the meantime get the rounds in and add me to your X-mas shopping list