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Thanks Jambo. I've read through most of the doc and there seems not to be a set guidance on harmonised application forms.Jambo wrote:See page 27 of Regulation 810/2009 (visa code)
Nowadays, the supporting document requirements are always based1. The requirement for an immigration visa
26. That national of a non-Member State should not be required to show any
independent reason for entering into the territory. His right, as a matter of
Community law, is derived from the right enjoyed by the Community national, so
that to require that person to fulfill formal conditions prior to entry into
national territory constitutes not only a restriction on his (derived) right but
also a restriction on the principal right of the Community national.
31. It is therefore apparent from the provisions of the directives on the
entry of members of the family, as interpreted by the Court, that entry
formalities must be restricted to the expressly specified documents and that any
further immigration procedure is not permissible.
"a document issued by the competent authority of the State of origin
or the State whence they came, proving their relationship"
This is why there is * sign to exempt EU family members from certain questions, because its actually against EU law to ask them.
3.6. Supporting documents
In order to prove that the applicant has the right to be issued with an entry visa under the
Directive, he must establish that he is a beneficiary of the Directive. This is done by
presenting documents relevant for the purposes of the three questions referred to above, i.e.
proving that:
• there is an EU citizen from whom the visa applicant can derive any rights;
• the visa applicant is a family member (e.g. a marriage certificate, birth certificate,
proof of dependency, serious health grounds, durability of partnerships …) and his
identity (passport); and
• the visa applicant accompanies or joins an EU citizen (e.g. a proof that the EU
citizen already resides in the host Member State or a confirmation that the EU
citizen will travel to the host Member State).
It is an established principle of EU law in the area of free movement that visa applicants have
the right of choice of the documentary evidence by which they wish to prove that they are
covered by the Directive (i.e. of the family link, dependency …). Member States may,
however, ask for specific documents (e.g. a marriage certificate as the means of proving the
existence of marriage), but should not refuse other means of proof.
For further information in relation to the documentation, see Commission Communication
COM (2009) 313 final34.
All the case law relates to resident permits, if they demand biometricsPlum70 wrote:Acme you say all this which sounds great but have you realised that:
The French Embassy in London (as of Feb 2012) now requires all visa nationals - no exemptions it seems - to personally present at the embassy for their biometrics to be taken? That is full facial/iris scan and 10 finger prints. The Embassy words it as: "In accordance with the European Council Decision 2004/512/EC, from 6 Feb 2012, the French Consulate will issue biometric visas - this new measure entails the compulsory appearance of all visa nationals (except children under the age of 12) as biometric data (photograph and fingerprints) must be collected." See also EC 2004/512/EC (2).
It appears to have been the commission's decision and vision to include biometrics as part of the VIS at some stage. Nowhere can I find an exemption for EU/EEA/CH family members. This is why I chose not to have my French Schengen visa renewed with the French and turned to the Germans but it seems i'm likely to be caught in the same net.
If anyone can find the exemption in law I would be grateful - thanks!
That would have been a good fall back but for one hiccup: I will not be visiting Switzerland this Summer. The document list requires proof of travel like a plane ticket of which I will have none. Sigh...flyboy wrote:Plum, why don't you get a visa from the swiss embassy considering that your spouse is Swiss? And they don't seem to be collecting biometrics yet.
You could apply in person without prior appointment at the Regional Consular Centre
http://ch.vfsglobal.co.uk/pdf/EUSpousevisa-290512.pdf
How is it "normal" that, in addition to everyone having biometric passports (holding facial and fingerprints data) which can be scanned/read/copied by embassies/border control and God knows who else, (EU FMs who are unfortunately) visa nationals now have to have biometrics taken again for the issuance of Schengen visas?EUsmileWEallsmile wrote:It's just normal in some places and people get on with it.
Perhaps you misunderstood me or I was not clear. What I was saying is that in some countries, it is normal that they have to carry an ID card and such an ID card might contain a photo, biometric data etc.Plum70 wrote:How is it "normal" that...EUsmileWEallsmile wrote:It's just normal in some places and people get on with it.
Just open a random online travel web-page, find any flight that matches what you need and print that...Plum70 wrote:...That would have been a good fall back but for one hiccup: I will not be visiting Switzerland this Summer. The document list requires proof of travel like a plane ticket of which I will have none. Sigh...
Thought about that but the Swiss explicitly say: Transport documentation by plane - airline or e-ticket.ca.funke wrote:Just open a random online travel web-page, find any flight that matches what you need and print that...Plum70 wrote:...That would have been a good fall back but for one hiccup: I will not be visiting Switzerland this Summer. The document list requires proof of travel like a plane ticket of which I will have none. Sigh...
I am not sure but when we enquired at the Embassy few years back the guy seemed to think I could get a multiple entry Schengen visa for free.EUsmileWEallsmile wrote:As a matter of interest, how does Switzerland treat family members of their own citizens? Is there an equivalent Singh provision?Plum70 wrote:...why don't you get a visa from the swiss embassy considering that your spouse is Swiss?
I misunderstood - apologies.EUsmileWEallsmile wrote:Perhaps you misunderstood me or I was not clear. What I was saying is that in some countries, it is normal that they have to carry an ID card and such an ID card might contain a photo, biometric data etc.Plum70 wrote:How is it "normal" that...EUsmileWEallsmile wrote:It's just normal in some places and people get on with it.
All the stamps do is record your points of entry and exit (and of course can be used to determine length of stay).Plum70 wrote:Do I risk the German border guards asking why I have no stamps for Austria?
Maybe you risk them asking... But if they do - so what?Plum70 wrote:Do I risk the German border guards asking why I have no stamps for Austria?
No embassy can ask for issued tickets before the visa is issued. What would you do if the visa is not approved?Plum70 wrote:This seems to me that they want to see a valid booked flight for which a ticket is then issued - no good.
I always wanted to spend a very long week in Vienna...ca.funke wrote:Maybe you risk them asking... But if they do - so what?Plum70 wrote:Do I risk the German border guards asking why I have no stamps for Austria?
When applying with the Austrians, you sticked exactly to the rules: You´re planning a Schengen-Trip which starts in Germany, but your main destination is Austria, isn´t it?
Plum70 wrote:This seems to me that they want to see a valid booked flight for which a ticket is then issued - no good.
You would expect so but seems the Swiss are... I will go for the lovely folks of Austria who I will no doubt visit soon.No embassy can ask for issued tickets before the visa is issued. What would you do if the visa is not approved?
http://www.admin.ch/ch/f/rs/142_209/a13.htmlPlum70 wrote:I am not sure but when we enquired at the Embassy few years back the guy seemed to think I could get a multiple entry Schengen visa for free.EUsmileWEallsmile wrote:As a matter of interest, how does Switzerland treat family members of their own citizens? Is there an equivalent Singh provision?Plum70 wrote:...why don't you get a visa from the swiss embassy considering that your spouse is Swiss?