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Take Oath in Abroad after Approval
Posted: Wed Jul 20, 2016 2:07 pm
by farrukh786786
Hello everybody,I want some guide over my worries so I could gather authentic information about the procedure from you experts here.My case briefly :- I had submitted my neutralisation application in April and bio done on 5th of May, now waiting for my approval but still have no luck.
I have to go to Pakistan after a couple of weeks because of my wife's illness for 3 months or may be more.My worry is if my approval comes when I would be in Pakistan ( as I have managed re-direction ) , could I able to take oth in Islambad Embassy and what is its procedure?? After oth I have to send my BRP card so how could I travel back to UK as I wont like to apply for British passport from abroad.Can I apply for a Urgent Travel Document from Islambad Embassy ??? Please experts help in this situation ,kindly guide me.
Really appreciate your kind replies .
Re: Take Oth in Abroad after Approval
Posted: Wed Jul 20, 2016 2:21 pm
by JohnnyZee
Unfortunately, I don't think you will be able to do the ceremony abroad, unless you are married to a British spouse.
Re: Take Oth in Abroad after Approval
Posted: Wed Jul 20, 2016 2:26 pm
by vinny
Re: Take Oth in Abroad after Approval
Posted: Wed Jul 20, 2016 8:43 pm
by farrukh786786
Really thank you both for your replies.its really shocking bad news for me anyhow you said I should to be married with british citizen thats mean I should have to apply my application as a current british spouse so I could able to avail this .
I had been married to a British Spouse in 2009 but in 2014 we were legally separated now what will be the chances ??
To avail this service in abroad , Do I still have to be a spouse of British Citizen ???
Please guide in this confusion .
Re: Take Oath in Abroad after Approval
Posted: Wed Jul 20, 2016 11:11 pm
by CR001
When you say 'legally separated', do you mean 'divorce' through the courts or just 'separated'.
And your wife who is ill, is this a different wife??
Re: Take Oath in Abroad after Approval
Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2016 4:55 am
by farrukh786786
CR001 wrote:When you say 'legally separated', do you mean 'divorce' through the courts or just 'separated'.
And your wife who is ill, is this a different wife??
Yes , divorce by court .Yes after wards I again got married but unfortunately she and my 2 years old son still did not get her spouse visa due to ECO's error and now I have an appeal on going .
Re: Take Oath in Abroad after Approval
Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2016 9:15 am
by CR001
If you are divorced from your ex British spouse then you are not the spouse of a BC and cannot avail of the option to have your ceremony overseas.
Re: Take Oath in Abroad after Approval
Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2016 9:48 am
by longhorn
You need to book the ceremony as soon as you receive the approval ideally within a couple of weeks but you will have 90 days to attend it. If your council allows you to book that far in advance, you may be able to book it on phone from abroad, come back within 90 days and attend it. Even if they don't offer a ceremony that far in advance, they may still do a private ceremony. Its worth asking them the question.
Re: Take Oath in Abroad after Approval
Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2016 10:01 am
by imnewhere
I applied in April and received my approval and attended ceremony already. Hopefully your approval is on the way. My guess would be in the next or so. Just hang on a bit and sort it all out before jetting off.
Good luck
Re: Take Oath in Abroad after Approval
Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2016 10:19 am
by farrukh786786
First of all bundle of thanks for all of you ,your valuable advice makes me clear on my confusions.
A couple of question raises in my mind after reading the @vinny 's posted link.
" If the applicant asks for an extension of time and gives an acceptable reason (see 6.11.22.6
below), an extension of up to 3 months may be allowed (or whatever longer period may be
justified by the reason given for the request). CCST action these requests. "
1- Please explain to whom I write for extension and what will be the time frame after I would receive my approval (as there is just 21 days to book it ) ??
Or I could first book my ceremony and then write for extension as a safer side .
2 - And what if my extension request would be rejected then what will be the options as I have read this section too ??
" If the applicant still wishes to become a British citizen, and had an entitlement at the date of
application, a certificate may be issued at any time on the basis of the original application on
payment of the balance of fee and attending a citizenship ceremony and making an
oath/pledge. "
What this section means ?? Even after that 90 days crossed I could able to attend ceremony ,please explain your replies are much appreciated .Really grateful to you guys.
Re: Take Oath in Abroad after Approval
Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2016 8:49 pm
by farrukh786786
@CR001 and @vinny please explain these section whenever anyone of you will take some spare time.please I humbly request .
Re: Take Oath in Abroad after Approval
Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2016 8:57 pm
by CR001
You can only ask for an extension to attend your ceremony, for exceptional and compelling reasons, once your citizenship application is approved. You will need to write to the HO team who sends you correspondence about your application or approval I think or speak to your council when you get your ceremony letter.
Re: Take Oath in Abroad after Approval
Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2016 10:45 pm
by farrukh786786
And what if my extension request would be rejected then what will be the options as I have read this section too ??
" If the applicant still wishes to become a British citizen, and had an entitlement at the date of
application, a certificate may be issued at any time on the basis of the original application on
payment of the balance of fee and attending a citizenship ceremony and making an
oath/pledge. "
What this section means ?? Even after that 90 days crossed I could able to attend ceremony ,please explain your replies are much appreciated .Really grateful to you guys.
Sorry if I be a pain but I'm really confused when I have read that section .
Re: Take Oath in Abroad after Approval
Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2016 9:29 am
by Casa
My interpretation is that you would have to pay the application fee again....but I'm open to other opinions.
Re: Take Oath in Abroad after Approval
Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2016 10:40 am
by CR001
farrukh786786 wrote:And what if my extension request would be rejected then what will be the options as I have read this section too ??
" If the applicant still wishes to become a British citizen, and had an entitlement at the date of
application, a certificate may be issued at any time on the basis of the original application on
payment of the balance of fee and attending a citizenship ceremony and making an
oath/pledge. "
What this section means ?? Even after that 90 days crossed I could able to attend ceremony ,please explain your replies are much appreciated .Really grateful to you guys.
Sorry if I be a pain but I'm really confused when I have read that section .
From what link did you get this? This implies you have an entitlement, which you don't. Your application is wholly discretionary.
Re: Take Oath in Abroad after Approval
Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2016 10:44 am
by farrukh786786
Casa wrote:My interpretation is that you would have to pay the application fee again....but I'm open to other opinions.
Please refer to @vinny posted link
section 6.11.22.15
Then what it exactly states.As far as I could understand that if I return to UK even though my 90 days deadline would have been crossed and most importantly I should have intouch with my Council so that It wont return my certificate to HO .And I'm willing to attend ceremony so I could do it but it should be as soon as possible.
To refer to section 6.11.22.16
It means that in all other cases when I wont intouch with my council and wont inform my returning dates and Council sent it back my certificate to HO , these circumstances would make HO doubt that an applicant wont take an oth and have not future settlement intentions in UK .
so in all these circumstances I have to re-apply.
As far as I would inform my Council it would be fine with me .
What you guys think ?? Am I right in my understanding ???
Re: Take Oath in Abroad after Approval
Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2016 10:59 am
by CR001
I would suggest that you wait until you have received an approval before guessing what could/might happen.
Re: Take Oath in Abroad after Approval
Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2016 12:45 pm
by cs95tdg
Transfers from the UK to abroad
6.11.22.11 The ethos and background relating to citizenship ceremonies is that new citizens are welcomed into their local community. A transfer should therefore only be granted if the applicant has applied for registration or for naturalisation under s.6(2) of the BNA 1981 and is outside the UK indefinitely. If applicants state that they will only away for a few months, we should consider offering an extension to allow them to attend the ceremony in the UK when they return.
6.11.22.12 CCST will not transfer naturalisation claims under s.6(1) as this will cast doubts about whether their future intentions lie in the UK. If a s.6(1) applicant states that they will be abroad for more than 6 months, CCST will refer the case to the appropriate Senior Caseworker to check whether the applicant satisfies the future intentions requirement.
6.11.22.13 Ifanapplicantdoesnotattendacitizenshipceremonywithinthe90daytimelimit,thelocal authority will notify CCST. CCST will then write out to the applicant for an explanation as to why they did not attend the ceremony. If a reasonable explanation is provided CCST will look to extend the deadline (see 6.11.22.6).
6.11.22.14 If an explanation is not provided, the application will be refused. The applicant will be informed that it will not be possible to become a British citizen because the Home Secretary is not able to register or naturalise a person who has not attended a ceremony and taken an oath/pledge.
6.11.22.15 IftheapplicantstillwishestobecomeaBritishcitizen, and had anentitlementatthedateof application, a certificate may be issued at any time on the basis of the original application on payment of the balance of fee and attending a citizenship ceremony and making an oath/pledge.
6.11.22.16 Inallothercases,theapplicantwillneedtore-applyunderanappropriateprovisionofthe legislation. (See paragraph 6.4 above)
6.11.22.17 Ifanapplicantappealsagainsttherefusal, thecaseshouldbereferredtotheQuality& Correspondence Team who will ensure that the correct decision was made. If this is the case, the appeal will be rejected.
6.11.22.18 IftherehasbeenaHomeOfficeerrorortheapplicanthasanentitlementtocitizenship, the case will be re-opened.
Nb. If any other reason is provided where a case may be re-opened, the case should be referred to the Chief Casework Officer who will consider the request in consultation with NPT.
Reading the sections in order it's not really clear what is precisely implied by 6.11.22.15 because of the words underlined. It says if the applicant
still wishes to become a British citizen, and also refers to having had an
entitlement on the date of the application. As far as the fee goes it refers to the payment of a
balance - again not really clear what's meant by that. If an application was previously approved, is then the applicant considered to have an entitlement to citizenship?
Either way what is clear is that it's not straightforward to transfer or delay a ceremony. And in all likelihood the OP would need to take things as they come after approval and contact both the council and the HO for clearer guidance based on his individual circumstances.
Re: Take Oath in Abroad after Approval
Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2016 4:06 pm
by farrukh786786
thank you brother @cs95tdg
Thats exactly my question is.
If an application was previously approved, is then the applicant considered to have an entitlement to citizenship?
its all confusing.Anyhow really grateful for everyone for their input.If some one could throw light on this its would be much appreciated.
Re: Take Oath in Abroad after Approval
Posted: Sun Jul 24, 2016 12:50 am
by secret.simon
farrukh786786 wrote:If an application was previously approved, is then the applicant considered to have an entitlement to citizenship?
No. An entitlement only arises when the person has an entitlement under a provision of the British Nationality Act 1981.
To the best of my knowledge, there is no entitlement for naturalisation.
The only entitlements to citizenship are those from registration. Most cases of registration only apply to minors, who do not need to attend citizenship ceremonies.
But people who applied for registration as a minor, but whose registration was approved when they had attained majority or people over the age of 18 who register under Section 1(4) of the BNA (a Form T application) have an entitlement to citizenship, but must attend a citizenship ceremony as well and the provisions of paragraph 6.11.22.15 highlighted above apply to such people.
To the OP: You have no alternative but to return to the UK to take the oath.
Once you get the letter inviting you to the ceremony, you can communicate with the council from overseas, make an appointment, take a flight, attend the ceremony and then fly back.
But the guidance is very clear.
6.11.22.12 CCST will not transfer naturalisation claims under s.6(1) as this will cast doubts about whether their future intentions lie in the UK. If a s.6(1) applicant states that they will be abroad for more than 6 months, CCST will refer the case to the appropriate Senior Caseworker to check whether the applicant satisfies the future intentions requirement.
Remember that the intention to settle in the UK is a requirement for naturalisation and if you demonstrate that the intention is not there, I think it could impact any future naturalisation application as well (assuming that you do not return to the UK to take the oath for the first application).
Re: Take Oath in Abroad after Approval
Posted: Sun Jul 24, 2016 11:43 am
by noajthan
CR001 wrote:If you are divorced from your ex British spouse then you are not the spouse of a BC and cannot avail of the option to have your ceremony overseas.
Its really very simple. To become British you have to show some degree of commitment to UK, as per the rules.