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Hi all my board fellows recently been caught in newly made rules of UKBA.
See these critical dates first

Arrived in UK 29 April 2001 (student visa)
PSW granted on 3 October 2008
Wife arrived from back home jan 2009
Applied for HSMP 2nd October 2010
Application rejected on 5 December 2010
appealed within 10 days to tier tribunal 1
appeal rejected last week and given right of appeal to upper chamber which i will submit this week.i intend to go to high court if needed to,though not sure how long this appeal procedure takes?Anyone got any clue how long you have to wait for high court decision?

MY Question is am when i will be eligible to apply for?
I always got visas on time and never have any trouble/refusal before?
never broken or caught by any court or ukba or home office.
only been out of the counry for less then 90 days in last 9.75 years.
never left UK in last 3 years.
is my case complicated or will be considered straight forward?
i am submitting all appeals on time and always submitted my application well on time.
this is first time that i have no visa since october 2010.although my psw has been extended by virtue of previous psw stamp.

Thanks in advance for all those who are going to reply here

Please give some more information:

1- On what grounds your Tier 1 was refused
2- What is the determination given by Immigration Judge to refuse your appeal.

angelloveguy wrote:Please give some more information:

1- On what grounds your Tier 1 was refused
2- What is the determination given by Immigration Judge to refuse your appeal.

tier 1 applied on basis of pgd from BITE.Applied on 2nd October 2010 and they changed rules so appealed and judge upheld their decision saying decision date is key and applying date is irrelvant.

Bigdeal wrote: judge upheld their decision saying decision date is key and applying date is irrelvant.

I dont believe that. Give an exact reason for refusal. Why did UKBA declined Tier 1, which requirement for Tier 1 did you not meet (or atleast UKBA think so)

xyz123 wrote:

Bigdeal wrote: judge upheld their decision saying decision date is key and applying date is irrelvant.

I dont believe that. Give an exact reason for refusal. Why did UKBA declined Tier 1, which requirement for Tier 1 did you not meet (or atleast UKBA think so)

you are right @xyz123.... applying date is always KEY not decision date, the OP, maybe, don't want to tell the reason in the forum. and HSMP is lost long time.
Probably the OP knew that his application will be rejected and he will appeal against the HO decision and by that time his stay will be 10 years to qualify for ILR.

Bigdeal wrote:Hi all my board fellows recently been caught in newly made rules of UKBA.
See these critical dates first

Arrived in UK 29 April 2001 (student visa)
PSW granted on 3 October 2008
Wife arrived from back home jan 2009
Applied for HSMP 2nd October 2010
Application rejected on 5 December 2010
appealed within 10 days to tier tribunal 1
appeal rejected last week and given right of appeal to upper chamber which i will submit this week.i intend to go to high court if needed to,though not sure how long this appeal procedure takes?Anyone got any clue how long you have to wait for high court decision?

MY Question is am when i will be eligible to apply for?

As far as I understand you can apply for ILR on 1st April 2011(you can easily drag your case till then).
Also, if you can, plz use good solicitor for your appeal and then vary your application on 1st April 2011.

If HO has accused you of deception then I'm not sure how it will unfold in court.

It will be helpful if you can quote the exact wordings of your refusal.

sunmoon wrote:

xyz123 wrote:

Bigdeal wrote: judge upheld their decision saying decision date is key and applying date is irrelvant.

I dont believe that. Give an exact reason for refusal. Why did UKBA declined Tier 1, which requirement for Tier 1 did you not meet (or atleast UKBA think so)

you are right @xyz123.... applying date is always KEY not decision date, the OP, maybe, don't want to tell the reason in the forum. and HSMP is lost long time.
Probably the OP knew that his application will be rejected and he will appeal against the HO decision and by that time his stay will be 10 years to qualify for ILR.

-
Thanks for replying gents.Judge used two references to prove first one is Odelola (2008) ECWA civ 308 and HS(India)(2005) UKAIT 00169.He used long references to prove his point that decision date has preference over applying date.These cases may be checked by pros if any of them is here.But my point is clear i have applied almost 1 month before when UKBA stop giving points.So this law doesn't applies to me or atleast Judge should have given me option of reapplying.

Regarding tier 1 upper chamber does anyone knows how long they take?

Lastly if im entitled to apply for ILR from 1st April,can i apply in person?
Does my case will be classified as simple/straightforward case/

Bigdeal wrote:

sunmoon wrote:

xyz123 wrote:

Bigdeal wrote: judge upheld their decision saying decision date is key and applying date is irrelvant.

I dont believe that. Give an exact reason for refusal. Why did UKBA declined Tier 1, which requirement for Tier 1 did you not meet (or atleast UKBA think so)

you are right @xyz123.... applying date is always KEY not decision date, the OP, maybe, don't want to tell the reason in the forum. and HSMP is lost long time.
Probably the OP knew that his application will be rejected and he will appeal against the HO decision and by that time his stay will be 10 years to qualify for ILR.

-
Thanks for replying gents.Judge used two references to prove first one is Odelola (2008) ECWA civ 308 and HS(India)(2005) UKAIT 00169.He used long references to prove his point that decision date has preference over applying date.These cases may be checked by pros if any of them is here.But my point is clear i have applied almost 1 month before when UKBA stop giving points.So this law doesn't applies to me or atleast Judge should have given me option of reapplying.

Regarding tier 1 upper chamber does anyone knows how long they take?

Lastly if im entitled to apply for ILR from 1st April,can i apply in person?
Does my case will be classified as simple/straightforward case/

Any specific reason why you have avoided my simple straight questons?

tall_funky wrote:plz use good solicitor for your appeal and then vary your application on 1st April 2011.

There is no application undecided / outstanding, so application for "variation of leave" is not possible unless the judge orders UKBA to reconsider their decision (the application could be deemed "undecided" in such case).

3.2 Applications lodged during leave under sections 3C and 3D wrote:However section 3C makes a clear distinction between the decision on the application and the appeal against that decision. Once an application has been decided it ceases to be an application and there is no longer any application to vary under section 3C (5). So any new information will fall to be dealt with during the course of the appeal rather than as a variation of the original application.

regards

sushdmehta wrote:

tall_funky wrote:plz use good solicitor for your appeal and then vary your application on 1st April 2011.

There is no application undecided / outstanding, so application for "variation of leave" is not possible unless the judge orders UKBA to reconsider their decision (the application could be deemed "undecided" in such case).

regards

Thats exactly what I meant and that's why I advised him to use good solicitor.
I agree you have put it in more clear/legal terms, Thanks for your help!

Regards

tall_funky wrote:

Bigdeal wrote:

sunmoon wrote:

xyz123 wrote:
I dont believe that. Give an exact reason for refusal. Why did UKBA declined Tier 1, which requirement for Tier 1 did you not meet (or atleast UKBA think so)

you are right @xyz123.... applying date is always KEY not decision date, the OP, maybe, don't want to tell the reason in the forum. and HSMP is lost long time.
Probably the OP knew that his application will be rejected and he will appeal against the HO decision and by that time his stay will be 10 years to qualify for ILR.

-
Thanks for replying gents.Judge used two references to prove first one is Odelola (2008) ECWA civ 308 and HS(India)(2005) UKAIT 00169.He used long references to prove his point that decision date has preference over applying date.These cases may be checked by pros if any of them is here.But my point is clear i have applied almost 1 month before when UKBA stop giving points.So this law doesn't applies to me or atleast Judge should have given me option of reapplying.

Regarding tier 1 upper chamber does anyone knows how long they take?

Lastly if im entitled to apply for ILR from 1st April,can i apply in person?
Does my case will be classified as simple/straightforward case/

Any specific reason why you have avoided my simple straight questons?

Which specific questions you are referring.

sushdmehta wrote:

tall_funky wrote:plz use good solicitor for your appeal and then vary your application on 1st April 2011.

There is no application undecided / outstanding, so application for "variation of leave" is not possible unless the judge orders UKBA to reconsider their decision (the application could be deemed "undecided" in such case).

3.2 Applications lodged during leave under sections 3C and 3D wrote:However section 3C makes a clear distinction between the decision on the application and the appeal against that decision. Once an application has been decided it ceases to be an application and there is no longer any application to vary under section 3C (5). So any new information will fall to be dealt with during the course of the appeal rather than as a variation of the original application.

regards

Does this referred case of Adeola applies to me.Not in legal lingo but can you explain me what's odds of getting ILR if my appeal get rejected by upper chamber and i decide to persue in High court.
Just to clarify there is no issue of deception and never have been....

Bigdeal wrote: Does this referred case of Adeola applies to me.Not in legal lingo but can you explain me what's odds of getting ILR if my appeal get rejected by upper chamber and i decide to persue in High court.
Just to clarify there is no issue of deception and never have been....

I think Adeola case applies to you.

What you really need to understand is this:

sushdmehta wrote:

tall_funky wrote:plz use good solicitor for your appeal and then vary your application on 1st April 2011.

There is no application undecided / outstanding, so application for "variation of leave" is not possible unless the judge orders UKBA to reconsider their decision (the application could be deemed "undecided" in such case).

3.2 Applications lodged during leave under sections 3C and 3D wrote:However section 3C makes a clear distinction between the decision on the application and the appeal against that decision. Once an application has been decided it ceases to be an application and there is no longer any application to vary under section 3C (5). So any new information will fall to be dealt with during the course of the appeal rather than as a variation of the original application.

tall_funky wrote:

Bigdeal wrote: Does this referred case of Adeola applies to me.Not in legal lingo but can you explain me what's odds of getting ILR if my appeal get rejected by upper chamber and i decide to persue in High court.
Just to clarify there is no issue of deception and never have been....

I think Adeola case applies to you.

What you really need to understand is this:

sushdmehta wrote:

tall_funky wrote:plz use good solicitor for your appeal and then vary your application on 1st April 2011.

There is no application undecided / outstanding, so application for "variation of leave" is not possible unless the judge orders UKBA to reconsider their decision (the application could be deemed "undecided" in such case).

3.2 Applications lodged during leave under sections 3C and 3D wrote:However section 3C makes a clear distinction between the decision on the application and the appeal against that decision. Once an application has been decided it ceases to be an application and there is no longer any application to vary under section 3C (5). So any new information will fall to be dealt with during the course of the appeal rather than as a variation of the original application.

Thanks I am going to see some solicitor tomorrow for advise

Thanks everyone for their advice.Now i have hired a solicitor who has already submitted appeal to upper chamber of tier 1.
Does any one have their experience.How long they take.

1-Just a quick update-My solicitor submitted appeal seeking "permission to appeal in upper tribunal" which we expect to decide in next 2-3 weeks.I have another qualification from UK which was recognised at time of application and still can get me points.Submitted all original docs.

If permission is given then another hearing is expected in 2 to three months time.

2-If there is no permission given then we can directly appeal to upper tribunal.(Not sure how that works).

3-Regarding my ILR my solicitor wants me to wait and saying we will discuss this later on.Still confused on point whether i can apply for ILR varying conditions of my stay or not.

Bigdeal wrote:Still confused on point whether i can apply for ILR varying conditions of my stay or not.

No, as explained in my response above, one may vary an undecided immigration application when under section 3c leave ... but in your case there is no "application" pending ... it is an appeal. And you cannot vary an appeal!


regards

sushdmehta wrote:

Bigdeal wrote:Still confused on point whether i can apply for ILR varying conditions of my stay or not.

No, as explained in my response above, one may vary an undecided immigration application when under section 3c leave ... but in your case there is no "application" pending ... it is an appeal. And you cannot vary an appeal!


regards

Ok thanks Sushdmehta.Got your point now.But as it sounds that if i got permission to appeal then I may complete 10 years of lawfull residence for purpose of ILR.Now in case of appeal allowed it is fine.

But in case of rejection will i be eligible to apply for ILR?but it sounds my status will become of an overstayer?

Today i recieved permission to appeal in upper tribunal.Going to present them a new evidence mentioned before,but not given.that was in point base calculator and still it is....

what are the chances that upper chamber is obliged to accept new evidence?

See also Refused Tier 1 visa and 2.3.6.

Bigdeal wrote:
But in case of rejection will i be eligible to apply for ILR?but it sounds my status will become of an overstayer?

I'm not an expert but as far as I know you wont be eligible to apply for ILR. you have to win your appeal then you can.

KDS wrote:

Bigdeal wrote:
But in case of rejection will i be eligible to apply for ILR?but it sounds my status will become of an overstayer?

I'm not an expert but as far as I know you wont be eligible to apply for ILR. you have to win your appeal then you can.

OK but i understand as my last leave is extended by virtue of section 3c and 3d if i get to complete 10 years of residence on 29/04/2011 then it can be 2 situations.

1) any new application will not be considered till there is final outcome by judiciary.
2) if i complete 10 year then i can go for ILR but while that application is decided i won't have any status and so not allowed to work/business or other benefits like nhs.

if i am wrong then may be mods can explain further.

Thanks vinny for your precious opinion.

Bigdeal wrote:

KDS wrote:

Bigdeal wrote:
But in case of rejection will i be eligible to apply for ILR?but it sounds my status will become of an overstayer?

I'm not an expert but as far as I know you wont be eligible to apply for ILR. you have to win your appeal then you can.

OK but i understand as my last leave is extended by virtue of section 3c and 3d if i get to complete 10 years of residence on 29/04/2011 then it can be 2 situations.

1) any new application will not be considered till there is final outcome by judiciary.
2) if i complete 10 year then i can go for ILR but while that application is decided i won't have any status and so not allowed to work/business or other benefits like nhs.

if i am wrong then may be mods can explain further.

Thanks vinny for your precious opinion.

I spoke 2 a lawyer. as your application rejected you wont qualify for 10 year legal stay ILR. if u win the case then u can apply for ILR . Or you could drag ur case to 14 years and apply then for ILR.

You said ur PGD is from BITE. It was a doggy school. UKBA knows that (just google that school) If they know u used deception then u have no chance might as well go back to save ur money on court etc.

KDS wrote:

Bigdeal wrote:

KDS wrote:

Bigdeal wrote:
But in case of rejection will i be eligible to apply for ILR?but it sounds my status will become of an overstayer?

I'm not an expert but as far as I know you wont be eligible to apply for ILR. you have to win your appeal then you can.

OK but i understand as my last leave is extended by virtue of section 3c and 3d if i get to complete 10 years of residence on 29/04/2011 then it can be 2 situations.

1) any new application will not be considered till there is final outcome by judiciary.
2) if i complete 10 year then i can go for ILR but while that application is decided i won't have any status and so not allowed to work/business or other benefits like nhs.

if i am wrong then may be mods can explain further.

Thanks vinny for your precious opinion.

I spoke 2 a lawyer. as your application rejected you wont qualify for ILR. if u win then u can apply for ILR . Or you could drag ur case to 14 years and apply then for ILR.

You said ur PGD is from BITE. It was a doggy school

OK.I think i need to clarify it more in detail.
Regarding your comment or opinion plz visit college someday.
people do say same things but not sure,with genuine students they r too strict.

Bigdeal wrote:

KDS wrote:

Bigdeal wrote:

KDS wrote:
I'm not an expert but as far as I know you wont be eligible to apply for ILR. you have to win your appeal then you can.

OK but i understand as my last leave is extended by virtue of section 3c and 3d if i get to complete 10 years of residence on 29/04/2011 then it can be 2 situations.

1) any new application will not be considered till there is final outcome by judiciary.
2) if i complete 10 year then i can go for ILR but while that application is decided i won't have any status and so not allowed to work/business or other benefits like nhs.

if i am wrong then may be mods can explain further.

Thanks vinny for your precious opinion.

I spoke 2 a lawyer. as your application rejected you wont qualify for ILR. if u win then u can apply for ILR . Or you could drag ur case to 14 years and apply then for ILR.

You said ur PGD is from BITE. It was a doggy school

OK.I think i need to clarify it more in detail.
Regarding your comment or opinion plz visit college someday.
people do say same things but not sure,with genuine students they r too strict.

they might be strict now but they use to be doggy

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