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Hi all, I decided to post here as previously I posted in the general forum last time but my queries are now specifically to do with the EEA route.

I am British, exercising treaty rights in Spain since August 2010. My fiance is Albanian and is not here legally but has been living here since June 2010 with me (not on contact but on bills and have an official letter from landlord etc). We are getting married this summer or just after (just getting all the complicated documents together for this).

I have been told that after marriage as soon as we have our certificate we should apply straight away for family permit to go to UK and not bother applying for his residency card in Spain, as my spouse he automatically will have the right to be in Spain with me with residency card or without and if we are going back to the UK not much point in applying for this. I have been in touch with two immigration advisors, once who said this would be fine and not an issue and another who said he would have to have Spanish residency to apply for FP. How is it possible for two specialist immigration advisors to give two completely different views on this??

Any thoughts, most grateful!

if you are living in spain right now, you can go to any municipality,or town hall, where marriages are taking place officially,and u can ask them if your fiance needs a residecy card in order to marry or no, very easy

amazighman wrote:if you are living in spain right now, you can go to any municipality,or town hall, where marriages are taking place officially,and u can ask them if your fiance needs a residecy card in order to marry or no, very easy

Thank you, but my question isn't whether he needs a residency card to marry, we know he doesn't. My question is if he needs to apply for a residency card AFTER we marry to apply for Family Permit to go to the UK.

Where to apply - the policy wrote:Applications for visit visas and EEA Family Permits can be made at any post designated by the Secretary of State to accept applications for entry clearance. The applicant will need to be in the third country or territory in accordance with that country or territory's immigration laws.

As you have already stated, he is presently illegal in Spain. To legalize his stay in Spain subsequent to your marriage and to prove his legal status in Spain for the purpose of EEA family permit, I believe he will need to apply for a residence card.

Please wait for others to confirm / correct me.

Thanks. But I guess he needs this if he is staying for over 3 months, and when we marry we will not be staying much longer... Maybe we can try for the FP and if application not accepted we can apply for the residency card?

look, from my little experience in greece, all embassies there do no accept any visa application without having a valid residency card, so i think this will be the same in spain,
you can try getting him a spanish residency card, then try eea fp, having a residency card ll be much helpful in your fp application.

regards

Laura721 wrote:Thanks. But I guess he needs this if he is staying for over 3 months, and when we marry we will not be staying much longer... Maybe we can try for the FP and if application not accepted we can apply for the residency card?

You might find some answers here:
http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewto ... sc&start=0


And also: http://www.ukvisas.gov.uk/en/ecg/eunati ... t#13627112

EUN2.2 Where can an EEA family permit be issued?
EEA family permits may be obtained from any visa issuing post. It is not necessary for an applicant to be lawfully or normally resident in the country to apply.

Some countries might impose restrictions, like the US. Where your biometrics are compare with the database of Homeland Security and the if the applicant is in violation of the immigration law, is subject of immediate apprehension and removal. However, I wouldn't know how Spain handles this.

Good Luck!

Thank you, Sounds to me like that the section you showed me is just what I needed! How could they possible not accept an application with that statement in their guidelines?!

hi i m from spain and i got my eea fp with in 7 days from madrid spain............i want to confirm u tht u cant apply for eea fp if u r not having residency card here in spain... u should wait till ur marrige and after marrige with ur (libro de familia) family book u can get ur residency card with in few days coz now law is changed n u will not have to apply ur residency card from ministry......for more details u can contact me ,,,i will guide u about method n required docoments....my number is 610 24 62 24... u can send me text before calling
regards

sushdmehta wrote:

Where to apply - the policy wrote:Applications for visit visas and EEA Family Permits can be made at any post designated by the Secretary of State to accept applications for entry clearance. The applicant will need to be in the third country or territory in accordance with that country or territory's immigration laws.

As you have already stated, he is presently illegal in Spain. To legalize his stay in Spain subsequent to your marriage and to prove his legal status in Spain for the purpose of EEA family permit, I believe he will need to apply for a residence card.

Please wait for others to confirm / correct me.

This is not correct, i think. Since the Metock Judgement, it is no longer a requirement , that a non-EEA family member/ spouse of an EEA national or a British national returning home after exercising treaty rights in an economic capacity, to show evidence of lawful residence in another member state to obtain an EEA family permit.

This requirement exist no more.

Thanks Obie

I've been reading other posts on the forum though regarding applications made in Spain for a family permit if you are British exercising treaty rights, and the fact that they often fail to recognize this as acceptable?? Anyone know about this, WORRYING....

I am actually meeting the British Ambassador in Spain in two weeks, maybe I should speak to him regarding this?!

sushdmehta wrote:As you have already stated, he is presently illegal in Spain. To legalize his stay in Spain subsequent to your marriage and to prove his legal status in Spain for the purpose of EEA family permit, I believe he will need to apply for a residence card.

Please wait for others to confirm / correct me.

As soon as the marriage happens, and so long as it is not a "marriage of convenience" (solely for immigration purposes) then the non-EU family member is instantly "legalized". You can apply for a Residence Card as a form of documentation of the situation, but that does not change the status of the person involved.

Note that there is only a 90 day grace period for new entrants to the country. I can not see why that would apply for somebody who was already (illegally) resident in the country and married an EU citizen who was also resident there.

Thank you Directive/2004/38/EC

What do you feel about Spain potentially not recognizing our application as they have in the past failed to recognize a British person in Spain exercising treaty rights? Surely this is not allowed?

Laura721 wrote:What do you feel about Spain potentially not recognizing our application as they have in the past failed to recognize a British person in Spain exercising treaty rights? Surely this is not allowed?

If you are planning to move to the UK, then why even bother with the Spanish application?

Obie wrote:

sushdmehta wrote:

Where to apply - the policy wrote:Applications for visit visas and EEA Family Permits can be made at any post designated by the Secretary of State to accept applications for entry clearance. The applicant will need to be in the third country or territory in accordance with that country or territory's immigration laws.

As you have already stated, he is presently illegal in Spain. To legalize his stay in Spain subsequent to your marriage and to prove his legal status in Spain for the purpose of EEA family permit, I believe he will need to apply for a residence card.

Please wait for others to confirm / correct me.

This is not correct, i think. Since the Metock Judgement, it is no longer a requirement , that a non-EEA family member/ spouse of an EEA national or a British national returning home after exercising treaty rights in an economic capacity, to show evidence of lawful residence in another member state to obtain an EEA family permit.

There are actually two parallel issues.

Metock was about the requirement for prior residence in an EU member state. This was often the requirement that the non-EU family member had lived for a significant amount of time there.

There is a separate issue about the requirement that the applicant is legally in or legally resident in the (EU or non-EU) country from which they are applying for a visa. This is not covered by the Metock decision.

Since the non-EU family member can only be turned down for a few reasons (non legit marriage, national security, public policy, public health), it is not clear that they would have a legal basis for refusing either application.

An example is if a Dutch citizen is visiting the US, marries their long term partner Canadian who is illegally resident there (and for the sake of the story is about to be deported), and they then want to apply for an EEA FP to move to the UK.

Yes, what we have been advised to do is to apply for FP after we are married, if application is not accepted because he does not have legal residency here (been told this is unlikely), we will apply for his residency card and send another application for FP once we have this.

But I have read on this forum that some people who applied for an FP here who were British nationals exercising treaty rights in Spain and married to a non EEA national, were not recognized as being an EEA member under Surinder Singh ruling...

Why not?

I am sure I read it somewhere a on a couple of threads! Maybe they did not show they were exercising treaty rights well enough... I have been working in Spain since August and have all of my monthly payslips...

Laura721 wrote:I am sure I read it somewhere a on a couple of threads! Maybe they did not show they were exercising treaty rights well enough... I have been working in Spain since August and have all of my monthly payslips...

You have to be very careful with the details of what you read in some of the threads.

If you have been working since August, you should have no problem doing the Singh.

Quick update: after all the trouble gathering our documents to get married here in Spain it is finally official, March 24th 2012! I must say on the basis that my fiance has no papers here, they have been more than helpful and accepting in every way.

We could get married earlier however we wanted to make a big event of it and have our friends and family come over to Spain for the celebrations.

Basically, once married, we want to apply for the family permit right away, ie the week after. But I am concerned they will use this against us.

We have been struggling here in Spain for 18 months together now, paying everything based on my one salary as my fiance has had a knee operation and all we want to do now is get back to the UK so that we can be more secure, around family and friends, both start working and get ourselves set up for life. But if we apply a couple of days after getting married surely this will be refused??

Make sure to collect and retain lots of historical evidence which will illistrate how long you have been together (e.g. evidence of travel together or events together), as well as evidence that you have been living together.

There may be an argument that you should NOT submit it with the initial EEA FP application. As a married person you should not have to produce more than your marriage certitificate.

If they then ask for more evidence, then you can show them that.

Thank you.

We are registered at the same address since March 2011 though we have been here together since June 2010 (in that sense for the missing gap we can only offer a letter from the Albanian embassy and landlady letter though we have these already as we had to have them for our marriage application). Apart from this we have the photos from the last 4 years and photos of 10 years ago. I have stamps in my passports for the 5 times I went to Albania and online flight confirmations for Albania/Greece/Italy wherever my fiance was at the time. Letters from my family who adore him and have met him numerous occasions here in Spain. I expect all the photos from our wedding in March we can also offer as both our families will be there. Anything else that springs to mind that may be useful?

My family has decided to emigrate from South Africa to Spain and we have had trouble finding out about the visas. My step-father and three sisters all have Swiss citizenship, and my mother is eligible for Swiss citizenship. I am a 25 year old South African citizen who lives as a financially dependent member of the household.

Would it be possible for me to move to Spain with my family? What kind of visa would I need to get? When my mother gets Swiss citizenship, will she be able to sponsor me or can my step-father sponsor me now? We've found such conflicting information that no one is really sure of anything anymore.