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safr wrote:just a little back ground of my case and status.I was on student visa.2009 Ho refuse to extend student visa because of gap b/w the commencement of course and month.even consideration rejected .Applied into another category FLR(O) rejection again.I am non-eaa national Applied for COA in December 2009.received approval on October 2010,Married November 2010,applied for residence card with bundle of proofs as bills,tenancy agreement,wife payslips,p60,bank statements,certificate of application send within 6 weeks time with right to work or take employment.HO visited our correspond address and found i was move 3 weeks ago,the house mates told them yes i was living with them but recently i moved but they don't know where i move that the only statement they given to ukba people.Basically my wife work in London and i work in Essex two different places and quite expensive travelling to commute every day,so we see each other on weekend i go to her place because she lives with her family friend,and i live in a rented room in other town as i mentioned earlier i work there,and it is quite obvious that you don't have to be under the one roof all the time circumstances varies.we are in a genuine relationship.Anyway they send us a rejection letter stated this is a marriage of convenience but given a right of appeal to tribunal and also it stated that they are thinking we are no more in any relationship.I sent a right of appeal form with the refusal explanation.Me and wife will go when they call us on hearing.I need advice ,any one has same experience/problem.What type of evidence we need to to proof that our relationship is existed,please help

rachellynn1972 wrote: Did you get a Certificate of Application after you send in your application? Or was it just rejected straight away?

safr wrote:certificate of application send within 6 weeks time with right to work or take employment

Jambo wrote:

rachellynn1972 wrote: Did you get a Certificate of Application after you send in your application? Or was it just rejected straight away?

Difficult to read one long paragraph but he does say:

safr wrote:certificate of application send within 6 weeks time with right to work or take employment

Not trying to defend the HO here but it is not a surprise that your case raised a few red flags. Got married to EU citizen after two refusals on two different categories, then changed address (did you inform the HO about the move?), not living together (at least most of the week). I'm not doubting your relationship but this is not a typical story. Be prepared to provide as much evidence that this is a genuine relationship.

rachellynn1972 wrote:

Jambo wrote:[quote="rachellynn1972
Did you get a Certificate of Application after you send in your application? Or was it just rejected straight away?

Difficult to read one long paragraph but he does say:

safr wrote:certificate of application send within 6 weeks time with right to work or take employment

Not trying to defend the HO here but it is not a surprise that your case raised a few red flags. Got married to EU citizen after two refusals on two different categories, then changed address (did you inform the HO about the move?), not living together (at least most of the week). I'm not doubting your relationship but this is not a typical story. Be prepared to provide as much evidence that this is a genuine relationship.

rachellynn1972 wrote:

Jambo wrote:

rachellynn1972 wrote: Did you get a Certificate of Application after you send in your application? Or was it just rejected straight away?

Difficult to read one long paragraph but he does say:

safr wrote:certificate of application send within 6 weeks time with right to work or take employment

Not trying to defend the HO here but it is not a surprise that your case raised a few red flags. Got married to EU citizen after two refusals on two different categories, then changed address (did you inform the HO about the move?), not living together (at least most of the week). I'm not doubting your relationship but this is not a typical story. Be prepared to provide as much evidence that this is a genuine relationship.

Two refusal mean nothing in regard to application of eea residence card under eu law because the non eea does not have any criteria as the spouse in the application but only to be the family member, you living and getting a residence card rely on your spouse exercising treaty right in UK. The onus is on the eea spouse to support the application with full writing and physical need if the marriage is real. as for now no criteria for the non eea spouse, his or her application may be refused 10x under immigration rule as long the eea is exercising treaty right, married and he/she is ready to stand in any court to back the non eea, he has right to live in UK. Moreover the eu law does not say they must be living together, even if they are divorce the non eea can still retain his/her residency right.

safr wrote:

rachellynn1972 wrote:

Jambo wrote:[quote="rachellynn1972
Did you get a Certificate of Application after you send in your application? Or was it just rejected straight away?

Difficult to read one long paragraph but he does say:

safr wrote:certificate of application send within 6 weeks time with right to work or take employment

Not trying to defend the HO here but it is not a surprise that your case raised a few red flags. Got married to EU citizen after two refusals on two different categories, then changed address (did you inform the HO about the move?), not living together (at least most of the week). I'm not doubting your relationship but this is not a typical story. Be prepared to provide as much evidence that this is a genuine relationship.

Two refusal mean nothing in regard to application of eea residence card under eu law because the non eea does not have any criteria as the spouse in the application but only to be the family member, you living and getting a residence card rely on your spouse exercising treaty right in UK. The onus is on the eea spouse to support the application with full writing and physical need if the marriage is real. as for now no criteria for the non eea spouse, his or her application may be refused 10x under immigration rule as long the eea is exercising treaty right, married and he/she is ready to stand in any court to back the non eea, he has right to live in UK. Moreover the eu law does not say they must be living together, even if they are divorce the non eea can still retain his/her residency right.

flames wrote:I could be wrong but i think i read some judgement on the AIT website (related to a case of marriage of convenience) were an immigration judge commented that its not enough for UKBA to say a couple aren't living together now or at any point but should prove that the couple never intended to live together in the first place. So , provided you can justify why you aren't living together at the moment i think you should be fine and i think your reasons are good enough (Job related).

Why can't you get a place of your own with both names on the lease agreement even though you could be meeting up at that place during weekends

Godott wrote:

flames wrote:I could be wrong but i think i read some judgement on the AIT website (related to a case of marriage of convenience) were an immigration judge commented that its not enough for UKBA to say a couple aren't living together now or at any point but should prove that the couple never intended to live together in the first place. So , provided you can justify why you aren't living together at the moment i think you should be fine and i think your reasons are good enough (Job related).

Why can't you get a place of your own with both names on the lease agreement even though you could be meeting up at that place during weekends

I really dont understand you people! Why do you help such cases???
System is sometimes TOO gentle on all of us.... '' Couple dont need to live together''? .. MAybe if couple were livign for 30 years togehter and then better job offer came for one of them , in order to provide more for the family, but obviously, this couple JUST got married!!!! : )

Is this not obvious? Why do you support such cases.. I wil never understand. I am truly disappointed.

In the End, I have only 1 question for the guy: '' Why did you get married in the first place if you remain separated as you could still be a non-married couple???'' What difference did it make to both of you? I doubt you were genuine at the first place.. Im sorry..

rachellynn1972 wrote:This individual came here for advice if you cannot give advice then just stay put, he said he is not in sham marriage and we have to agree with him for that, there are process under eu law to detect sham marriage, HO have to interview them before concluding not mere not living together. So advice him if you can, like i said get backup from families, friends and love ones, if he can get that and the eea spouse is ready to confront HO for concluding that on her marriage, then he has no problem. Moreover if HO have concluded it was a sham they will not have granted appeal they would have treated him as immigration on national law not eu law, not until that he is still the family of an eea.immigration on national law not eu law, not until that he is still the family of an eea.

safr wrote:

rachellynn1972 wrote:This individual came here for advice if you cannot give advice then just stay put, he said he is not in sham marriage and we have to agree with him for that, there are process under eu law to detect sham marriage, HO have to interview them before concluding not mere not living together. So advice him if you can, like i said get backup from families, friends and love ones, if he can get that and the eea spouse is ready to confront HO for concluding that on her marriage, then he has no problem. Moreover if HO have concluded it was a sham they will not have granted appeal they would have treated him as immigration on national law not eu law, not until that he is still the family of an eea.immigration on national law not eu law, not until that he is still the family of an eea.

Thank you rachellynn..I really appreciate your comments and quotation,Yes we can proof our relationship and Inshallah we will win.God Bless

rachellynn1972 wrote:This individual came here for advice if you cannot give advice then just stay put, he said he is not in sham marriage and we have to agree with him for that, there are process under eu law to detect sham marriage, HO have to interview them before concluding not mere not living together. So advice him if you can, like i said get backup from families, friends and love ones, if he can get that and the eea spouse is ready to confront HO for concluding that on her marriage, then he has no problem. Moreover if HO have concluded it was a sham they will not have granted appeal they would have treated him as immigration on national law not eu law, not until that he is still the family of an eea.immigration on national law not eu law, not until that he is still the family of an eea.

Godott wrote:

flames wrote:I could be wrong but i think i read some judgement on the AIT website (related to a case of marriage of convenience) were an immigration judge commented that its not enough for UKBA to say a couple aren't living together now or at any point but should prove that the couple never intended to live together in the first place. So , provided you can justify why you aren't living together at the moment i think you should be fine and i think your reasons are good enough (Job related).

Why can't you get a place of your own with both names on the lease agreement even though you could be meeting up at that place during weekends

I really dont understand you people! Why do you help such cases???
System is sometimes TOO gentle on all of us.... '' Couple dont need to live together''? .. MAybe if couple were livign for 30 years togehter and then better job offer came for one of them , in order to provide more for the family, but obviously, this couple JUST got married!!!! : )

Is this not obvious? Why do you support such cases.. I wil never understand. I am truly disappointed.

In the End, I have only 1 question for the guy: '' Why did you get married in the first place if you remain separated as you could still be a non-married couple???'' What difference did it make to both of you? I doubt you were genuine at the first place.. Im sorry..

nonspecifics wrote:I was under the impression that if they have a marriage certificate that is the legal proof it is a genuine marriage.

Then the burden of evidence is on UKBA to prove the marriage is false. UKBA can ( legally) only deprive an EEA national of their rights if they have FIRST proved the marriage is not genuine by properly investigating it. ( not just suspicion).

I agree with the other posters that it's best if you provide as much other evidence to support the marriage being genuine, as otherwise you might need to go from appeal to appeal to uphold your rights, cos UKBA will be suspicious because of your previous immigration history.

See this case law for a similar example:

http://www.courtsni.gov.uk/NR/rdonlyres ... 8final.htm

safr wrote:just a little back ground of my case and status.I was on student visa.2009 Ho refuse to extend student visa because of gap b/w the commencement of course and month.even consideration rejected .Applied into another category FLR(O) rejection again.I am non-eaa national Applied for COA in December 2009.received approval on October 2010,Married November 2010,applied for residence card with bundle of proofs as bills,tenancy agreement,wife payslips,p60,bank statements,certificate of application send within 6 weeks time with right to work or take employment.HO visited our correspond address and found i was move 3 weeks ago,the house mates told them yes i was living with them but recently i moved but they don't know where i move that the only statement they given to ukba people.Basically my wife work in London and i work in Essex two different places and quite expensive travelling to commute every day,so we see each other on weekend i go to her place because she lives with her family friend,and i live in a rented room in other town as i mentioned earlier i work there,and it is quite obvious that you don't have to be under the one roof all the time circumstances varies.we are in a genuine relationship.Anyway they send us a rejection letter stated this is a marriage of convenience but given a right of appeal to tribunal and also it stated that they are thinking we are no more in any relationship.I sent a right of appeal form with the refusal explanation.Me and wife will go when they call us on hearing.I need advice ,any one has same experience/problem.What type of evidence we need to to proof that our relationship is existed,please help

...We sent all the required proof and now appeal been allowed by the tribnal,hearing next month My qestion is how important to involve the solicitor to deal my case,is that necessary to hire a lawyer or we both husband and wife with witness can attend hearing,honestly we have not sufficient fund to go through lawyer.Iknow my case is very complex,thas why iam here using this forum with the hope people gives us valuable advice and quotation.Regards

treefriend wrote:Hi Safr,
when is ur hearing and where you live. Our eee2 was also refused on the almost similar grounds. Our hearing is on 2/09/11
thank you..yes i liv in ipswic.did u tak adv frm any solictor or you represntin your case wdot solictor..gud luk.we will inshallah win..m going wd my wife and witnesses..thas all i prepare..anway gudluk.
best of luck