Immigration officers suprise visit

[jasmina]

Hi,

(Let's start from the beginning, I'm EU national, my husband is NON-EU National, and we applied in 2013 for Resident Card.
They refused us on the first application saying that I'm not a qualified person, as the boss for who I was working, didn't do anything about my taxes, the system showed him that my part-time salary it's small so with that amount I don't need to contribute tax. I'm just an employee so why would I know that.

Ok , they refused again and we appealed to First-Tier Tribunal, we got a case in July 2014, even my mother came as a witness, but still they refused as later, as a marriage of convenience, sham marriage. (It was a very stressful experience, we didn't reply the same about visiting him in another country than UK- it was few times I visited him and they asked where I was staying - hotel, house of his family, and I made a mistake there but we got some flight tickets and photos)

They refused us and we changed the lawyer,.

We made a fresh application on May that year, we gave around 5kg of documents.)

NOW: I'm self-employed and working for a company.

The problem is I was away to my country for 3 months, but anyway just came back recently and will come back to work.

So they came few days ago knocking our door like crazy, our neighbour opened, we were sleeping together and opened the door to the room for them, they were talking, asking about my work, gave them accountant's letter that she acts as my accountant, I don't do payslips as the money I get is small, it's an additional work to my normal work.
The other two officers talked with me in other room and one stayed with my husband. He asked him just about our previous addresses and photos for example. Or if he knows what kind of work I'm doing.
The officers who talked with me were quite not friendly, if not to say intimidating, they found in my text messages that I was away, and that how it's possible the boss didn't fire me, I said he just didn't.
They saw my text messages with my husband but didn't comment it.
I am very stressed as I thought the most important thing is that they found us together and that 3 months holiday it's not a big deal as we are not a sham marriage.

Please, if you have any ideas let me know

Thanks,

Jasmina

[noajthan]

Hi,

(Let's start from the beginning, I'm EU national, my husband is NON-EU National, and we applied in 2013 for Resident Card.
They refused us on the first application saying that I'm not a qualified person, as the boss for who I was working, didn't do anything about my taxes, the system showed him that my part-time salary it's small so with that amount I don't need to contribute tax. I'm just an employee so why would I know that.

...

NOW: I'm self-employed and working for a company.

The problem is I was away to my country for 3 months, but anyway just came back recently and will come back to work.

...

I am very stressed as I thought the most important thing is that they found us together and that 3 months holiday it's not a big deal as we are not a sham marriage.

Please, if you have any ideas let me know

Thanks,
Jasmina

An EEA national who is exercising treaty rights as a qualified person in UK may be absent for up to 6 months (in a year) without interrupting their continuing residency in UK.

See forum FAQS about PR:
http://www.immigrationboards.com/eea-ro ... 14867.html

and see Regulation 3:
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2006 ... ion/3/made

So you evidently demonstrated you are living together & you are entitled to take a holiday away from UK if you wish to.

[jasmina]

Hi, thanks for a quick and positive response.

I was really scared, as where I work it's a cleaning company, and the officer was making jokes of me that he cleans more than me in his life and generally they were extremely sarcastic. When I asked them 'so what's gonna happen with our case' , he replied: 'they will probably refuse, but that's HO who decide'.


Well, yes we demonstrated that we live together and that's my only hope.

Thanks again.

[noajthan]

Hi, thanks for a quick and positive response.

I was really scared, as where I work it's a cleaning company, and the officer was making jokes of me that he cleans more than me in his life and generally they were extremely sarcastic. When I asked them 'so what's gonna happen with our case' , he replied: 'they will probably refuse, but that's HO who decide'.

Well, yes we demonstrated that we live together and that's my only hope.

Thanks again.

It sounds a very unpleasant and rude awakening.
Try to forget about those people as they are not the decision-makers in your case.

It is unclear if the inspection was actually intended to determine if you are a qualified person (a self-employed person) OR if you are truly married (or both).

Be aware that HO has introduced a minimum income or MET test for self-employed persons.

This FOI request may be of interest:
https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/ ... _for_a_sel
- notice HO have not yet replied to it

There is more about MET here:
https://www.freemovement.org.uk/using-m ... ne-worker/

[jasmina]

Well, I hope that all will go right as I have no more power to fight with them.

[noajthan]

Well, I hope that all will go right as I have no more power to fight with them.

Don't give up.

There is one thing to think about if your income from self-employment is very variable or on the low side.
If that is the case your time in the 'self-employed category' may not be counted towards acquiring permanent residence (PR) in UK.

However time can also be counted as a 'self-sufficient' person.
You would still have to live off your income (and any savings) BUT the time will then count towards PR.
(You could still keep working as a self-employed person with your own business too).

To be classed as 'self-sufficient' you would have to have a health insurance policy (CSI) or possibly an EHIC card from your country (not a UK one).
From the forum it seems a CSI does not have to cost too much per month.

So if you feel comfortable with self-employed status that is fine.
I just suggested there is the possibility of 'self-sufficient' status to help make sure your time in UK is not 'wasted' and will go towards acquiring PR.

PS Don't be to upset by this bad experience, there are always one or two bad apples you meet from time to time.

[jasmina]

I have EHIC Card, but Brittish, I would make one from my Country in the future then.

I didn't know that the EHIC counts as self-suficient person.

I would definitely consider that in the future.

Yes, I hope that I won't need to have such experiences anymore, so we could finally live normal. Ex: even when I go to visit my family I always need to do it alone. Now, hopefully we could travel anywhere in EU together.

[noajthan]

I have EHIC Card, but Brittish, I would make one from my Country in the future then.

I didn't know that the EHIC counts as self-suficient person.

I would definitely consider that in the future.

...

If you decide self-sufficient status is an option for you (to be sure of exercising treaty rights) then the safest thing to do is arrange CSI.
But no harm in obtaining the EHIC card from your country too.

[bluecole2]

So they came few days ago knocking our door like crazy, our neighbour opened, we were sleeping together and opened the door to the room for them, they were talking, asking about my work, gave them accountant's letter that she acts as my accountant, I don't do payslips as the money I get is small, it's an additional work to my normal work.
The other two officers talked with me in other room and one stayed with my husband. He asked him just about our previous addresses and photos for example. Or if he knows what kind of work I'm doing.
The officers who talked with me were quite not friendly, if not to say intimidating, they found in my text messages that I was away, and that how it's possible the boss didn't fire me, I said he just didn't.
They saw my text messages with my husband but didn't comment it.
I am very stressed as I thought the most important thing is that they found us together and that 3 months holiday it's not a big deal as we are not a sham marriage.

Please, if you have any ideas let me know

Jasmina I am sorry to read that you've gone through some serious unpleasant moment in relation to your husbands status. I was livid reading this.

Let me focus more on the second part which is something I hope to enlighten members of this forum on someday soon. There is something called 'implied right of access' If you don't wish to see HO ever again in your home to stress you, you should right to them to withdraw their implied right of access to your property which inturn means that no fool of HO or UKVI whatever the they are can come to your home again or they will be trespassing.

You need not to worry or stress yourself, I understand the pressure might be on you guys and want to be done with this, but would you rather both know your rights and stand up for it or let some idiots with badge trample and walk over you because you want RC for your husband? The RC he already has acquired through your marriage. The onus is on HO to prove that your marriage is a sham within the law not outsde it, you may choose to show them the record of communication at most but not the content. Acting like a holigans banging on your door, evading your privacy so mcuh that your neighbour know what's going on in your family is wrong and unlawful. Just in case you don't know, not even the police can enter your home except you're suspected of a crime or you invie them in.

Next time they come banging on your door without invitation at such a time, take a camera and record them and refuse them entre and don't forget that you have to right to remain silent if you wish, that can not be used against you.

The bottom line of what I am trying to say here is- don't just know your righs, defend it. Do not let some human like you with a uniform or badge bully or walk over you, they would try to tell you you're wrong but if you know your rights, they will look like a fool. And things like this will never happen again and you'll be much more happy in your community.

To all those that worry about HO/UKVI visit, don't be scared, harm yourselves you infos on your rights, study it and stand up for it.

Best wishes people.

[smilingfriends]

Postby jasmina » Tue Sep 22, 2015 3:42 pm

Hi,

(Let's start from the beginning, I'm EU national, my husband is NON-EU National, and we applied in 2013 for Resident Card.
They refused us on the first application saying that I'm not a qualified person, as the boss for who I was working, didn't do anything about my taxes, the system showed him that my part-time salary it's small so with that amount I don't need to contribute tax. I'm just an employee so why would I know that.


HI JASMINA, I WONDER HOW HO FIND OUT THAT YOUR BOSS WAS NOT PAYING YOUR TAXES, DIDN'T YOU HAD YOUR PAYSLIPS FOR THAT PERIOD TO SHOW, OR DID HO CHECKED IT DIRECTLY FROM THE HMRC THEMSELVES....

[Casa]

Postby jasmina » Tue Sep 22, 2015 3:42 pm

Hi,

(Let's start from the beginning, I'm EU national, my husband is NON-EU National, and we applied in 2013 for Resident Card.
They refused us on the first application saying that I'm not a qualified person, as the boss for who I was working, didn't do anything about my taxes, the system showed him that my part-time salary it's small so with that amount I don't need to contribute tax. I'm just an employee so why would I know that.


HI JASMINA, I WONDER HOW HO FIND OUT THAT YOUR BOSS WAS NOT PAYING YOUR TAXES, DIDN'T YOU HAD YOUR PAYSLIPS FOR THAT PERIOD TO SHOW, OR DID HO CHECKED IT DIRECTLY FROM THE HMRC THEMSELVES....

All Government systems share information, which means it is extremely easy for the Home Office to check tax records directly with HMRC.

[noajthan]

Postby jasmina » Tue Sep 22, 2015 3:42 pm

Hi,

(Let's start from the beginning, I'm EU national, my husband is NON-EU National, and we applied in 2013 for Resident Card.
They refused us on the first application saying that I'm not a qualified person, as the boss for who I was working, didn't do anything about my taxes, the system showed him that my part-time salary it's small so with that amount I don't need to contribute tax. I'm just an employee so why would I know that.


HI JASMINA, I WONDER HOW HO FIND OUT THAT YOUR BOSS WAS NOT PAYING YOUR TAXES, DIDN'T YOU HAD YOUR PAYSLIPS FOR THAT PERIOD TO SHOW, OR DID HO CHECKED IT DIRECTLY FROM THE HMRC THEMSELVES....

Why are so many posters so obsessed with paying tax or not paying tax?

Is it not clear by now that the HO, (inefficient & bureaucratic as it may be), still has all the resources of the state behind it;
this includes many datasources & databases which, if a caseworker gets his act together, can be used to crosscheck & verify almost any applicant.

So part of the solution to keeping a clean 'good character' record is clearly to work legally and to "render to Caesar the things that are Caesar's".

And in this particular case it's not clear the lady was 'avoiding' taxes at all (I don't understand that she was );
it appears the income relatively low and so was not subject to tax.

... , as the boss for who I was working, didn't do anything about my taxes, the system showed him that my part-time salary it's small so with that amount I don't need to contribute tax. I'm just an employee so why would I know that.

[jasmina]

it came the refusal letter today, i am totally devastated...i have no money for solicitor, i said for her we are going to appeal by ourselves. I have no idea when it will finish,...they said I don't excercise threaty rights, coz I was 3 months away, now I'm just self-employed person and looking for other work to give more prooves...i might start university as well from january so i hope it might help...

tell me if we can do appeal to court alone? we have no other chance, and what can we write here? really dont know

[noajthan]

it came the refusal letter today, i am totally devastated...i have no money for solicitor, i said for her we are going to appeal by ourselves. I have no idea when it will finish,...they said I don't excercise threaty rights, coz I was 3 months away, now I'm just self-employed person and looking for other work to give more prooves...i might start university as well from january so i hope it might help...

tell me if we can do appeal to court alone? we have no other chance, and what can we write here? really dont know

I don't have details of the appeal process but you surely have grounds for appeal.

An absence from UK of less than 6 months should not interrupt continuous exercise of treaty rights.
As per: http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2006 ... ion/3/made

Note: If you become a student you will need CSI (or at very least an EHIC from your country, not a UK EHIC).
This is to ensure your time as a student counts towards PR.

Good luck.

[jasmina]

Thank you for respond. Please I have another request.

As we will write all alone (the appeal), I would like to ask if potentially I will be able to register tomorrow for CSI and attach it to the appeal, showing that I'm excercising threaty rights - apart from being self-employed person( will it be helpful?).
Is it any possibility as well to register with CSI , but showing I am registered with them not just from now, but from July(When I was away),to show I was self-sufficient from July.

The other thing is do you know how many days for appeal do we have as the solicitor said we have time untill 26th of this month, but on gov uk website they state otherwise= two weeks.

The solicitor also said I can't be away from work for 3 months= that just 21 or 28 days or something like that...
The other thing is I will get the payslip from my employment (not self-employment) for that month- but not the other months( not July, August, September), should I attach it to the appeal?

The last question is: Can I say for them that I don't agree with their decision, that I'm excercising threaty rights as I can be away from UK up to 6 months a year.


Sorry bothering you...but seems there's noone to help apart from you and that website

[noajthan]

Thank you for respond. Please I have another request.

As we will write all alone (the appeal), I would like to ask if potentially I will be able to register tomorrow for CSI and attach it to the appeal, showing that I'm excercising threaty rights - apart from being self-employed person( will it be helpful?).
Is it any possibility as well to register with CSI , but showing I am registered with them not just from now, but from July(When I was away),to show I was self-sufficient from July.

The other thing is do you know how many days for appeal do we have as the solicitor said we have time untill 26th of this month, but on gov uk website they state otherwise= two weeks.

The solicitor also said I can't be away from work for 3 months= that just 21 or 28 days or something like that...
The other thing is I will get the payslip from my employment (not self-employment) for that month- but not the other months( not July, August, September), should I attach it to the appeal?

The last question is: Can I say for them that I don't agree with their decision, that I'm excercising threaty rights as I can be away from UK up to 6 months a year.

Sorry bothering you...but seems there's noone to help apart from you and that website

I do not have experience of these appeals so hopefully other members will step up to support you too.

I don't know the time limit for an appeal.

CSI is a type of insurance so (to my knowledge) it cannot be backdated.
If you are in the category of a self-sufficient person (or a student) you would need CSI otherwise there is no need for it.

The regulations seem clear enough, you can be absent from UK for up to 6 months.
So 3 months should be acceptable.

Yes, if you have any relevant information then explain what it is in a covering letter and include it.

Yes, definitely quote the relevant law & the regulations to justify your absence from UK.
You should try to make & state a clear case based on the rules & regulations.
So, for example, regarding absences & continuity of treaty rights, quote:
Immigration (European Economic Area) Regulations 2006 & in particular, Regulation 3

If there are any specific personal or compassionate reasons for your absence you could explain that as well; (try to put it clearly & simply without too much emotion).

If there are specific details & reasons in the refusal letter then try to address them & refute them (with your evidence), one by one.
That is how you will win your appeal.

Don't forget to keep a copy of everything you submit in your appeal, (letter & evidence), for your reference.

Looking forward to see what help other members can kindly offer for you too.

[noajthan]

Jasmina,
To help people advise you can you post the refusal letter you have received?
(but leave out all personal details).

[jasmina]

Sure, I will do it, but firstly I need to take it from my Solicitor. I also didn't all the letter yet,

Thanks