Family Visitor Visa refusal 2nd time? shock?

shafa · Post by **shafa** » Tue Apr 17, 2012 1:59 pm

Hello

I am UK citizen my wife is pakistani and we applied for visitor visa for my MIL (mother in law)

The first application was 18th March 2012 -refused because her property documents were not translated, her divorce certificate was not translated and her bank statements were not explained (cash deposits)

We applied again 4th April as my wife is expecting our second child, my wife does not work but she just wanted her mum around for the birth of the child, not for child minding but just being there

In this application we provided:
1. Her bank statements with signed document explaining cash deposits which are wages and rent from her properties
2.translated and attested Divorce certificate and land ownership documents
3. signed letter from her employer confirming 5 week visit as unpaid leave
(My bank statements and payslip just in case)
Proeprty letter from me stating sufficient space but ECO was satisfied with all of this

Refused again because she could validate all of the transactions in her account and the ECO was nervous as she had not travelled outside pakistan before (we did submit her Hajj documentation but seems to have been ignored) and complied with immigration law

My wife even had letter from doctor confirming that she is 8 months pregnant

We only stated she would be staying here 5 weeks as she has family, propertly and a job to go back for.

We really want her to come here for a short visit (1st time since our marriage 7 years ago) and are think of applying for a 3rd time, this time submitting a full explanation of every single transaction (from 1 PKR to 100,000 PKR,) submitting her Hajj passport confirming her entry and exit on time from Saudia arabia)

What do you guys think? would applying for 3rd time make us sound desperate? or determined

Whilst I can understand the need to reduce immigration and how people have let let this down but why on earth would a 45 year old women from Pakistan with properties worth in excess of £300K and full time employment, along with family want to run away to a recession rife UK, work illegally for cash?

It literally makes no sense

krazydude · Post by **krazydude** » Tue Apr 17, 2012 4:22 pm

My wife even had letter from doctor confirming that she is 8 months pregnant

This could have played a role in the rejection of her application. Usually such situations lead the ECO to believe that the person will come over for child-minding.

shafa · Post by **shafa** » Tue Apr 17, 2012 5:08 pm

If my wife does not work how can it constitute child minding as they would both be at home and it was only going to be for 5 weeks

I think its getting to the point where they are just rejecting applications for the sake of it

My MIL get paid cash for her wages on a weekly baisis so why is this such a problem for ECO?

Is it worth appealing or re-applying 3rd time with details of every transaction

shafa · Post by **shafa** » Wed Apr 18, 2012 10:06 am

Hello everyone, could someone please shed some light on this? Any Senior Members or moderators?

hip999 · Post by **hip999** » Thu Apr 19, 2012 12:19 am

I have heard of people who have been permitted entry to visit family in the past but now are being refused.
I think it is just that the right-wing government we have in power is interested only in getting its wealthy chums in, so they can holiday on their yachts. They are not interested in the 'ordinary' man and so those who have the vote must ensure we never have to suffer the consequences of a right-wing government again.

gollywood · Post by **gollywood** » Thu Apr 19, 2012 1:13 am

I would appeal. Appeal judges are more sympathetic to these issues. HO usually hate these kinds of appeals! Good luck!

Post by **vinny** » Thu Apr 19, 2012 1:19 am

What were the exact reasons for the latest refusal?

shafa · Post by **shafa** » Thu Apr 19, 2012 8:44 am

The exact reasons for refusal were

1. A supporting document accompanying the UNB bank statement was enclosed that explained each cash transaction such as wages and rent. Out of 10 transactions only one was left unexplained. So the ECO had doubt she had access to this money

2.She has never travelled outside to pakistan -However we submitted her visa details and passport for when she went on Hajj in 2011. Now this seems to have been ignored or that they thought its not a western country but the ECO felt nervous as he thought she had not travelled outside pakistan before

So those are the two reasons for the refusal, I would really appreciate views of anyone that feels we should no re-apply for 3rd time or appeal

The other thing I was thinking about is that do anyone feel it being olympic year they are trying to restrict the amount of people coming in or are giving priority to people that are on the balance of probabilities least likely to abscond

Post by **vinny** » Thu Apr 19, 2012 9:53 am

Exact wording used by the ECO may be helpful.

shafa · Post by **shafa** » Thu Apr 19, 2012 10:10 am

1.YOu have submitted a personal statement which explains some of the transactions however one is not validated For example between 1/12/2011-28/12/2-11 a total of PKR 266,000 (£1850) has been deposited which is over 5 times your monthly income, I am therefore not satisfied that they are genuinely available to for your proposed visit or that they accurately represent your financial circumstances all of the above leads me to doubt your credibility and intentions in going to the UK

~2. Added to this have not travelled outside Pakistan before and therefore not demonstrated compliance with any restrictions imposed on your stay in another country which might offset my concerns# We submitted her Hajj passport which shows compliance why did they ignore this surely this is better than someone who has not travelled out before???

I have recognised the importance of family visits and the compassionate circumstances surrounding this application regarding the birth of your grandchild however I am not satisfied these outweigh my other concerns against the requirements of the immigration rules. In the light of the above and given your circumstances at presented I am not satisfied that on the balance of probabilities that your intentions are as you have set out this means that I am not satisfied that you are genuine seeking entry as a family visitor or that you intend to leave the UK on completion of your visit

This is tripe, what your thoughts Vinny?

shafa · Post by **shafa** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 9:10 am

Hello I wondered if anyone had any thoughts? thanks

Post by **vinny** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 11:04 am

MAA5 What evidence of maintenance is required? wrote:Where there is doubt that the funds will be at the disposal of the applicant, the ECO may ask them for a written undertaking

However, while it may be helpful to explain the deposited income, note that:

Entry clearance decision making: a global review[/url] > [url=http://icinspector.independent.gov.uk/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/Entry-Clearance-Decision-Making_A-Global-Review.pdf]Figure 19: Case study – additional information requirements in Abu Dhabi wrote:Chief Inspector’s comments:
• There is no requirement in the Immigration Rules to evidence the provenance of funds, ...

There was also Failure to consider positive evidence of her past travel outside Parkistan. Moreover, as far as I'm aware, past travel is not a requirement in the Immigration Rules.

shafa · Post by **shafa** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 12:03 pm

Thanks Vinny

What are your thoughts on appeal or re-apply with missing documents or emphasis on ECO ignoring valid details whilst stating the points you have mentioned?

Post by **vinny** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 12:16 pm

First, raise these issues with the ECO/ECM.

If they don't respond , then she may both appeal (within the appeal deadline), with additional evidence, wait for the ECM review, and reapply.

shafa · Post by **shafa** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 12:17 pm

Thank you once again but how do I raise issues with ECO I thought I could only re-apply or wait 5-6 months of appeal?

thanks

Shaf

Post by **vinny** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 12:19 pm

Write to them first. An ECM review may reverse the refusal decision sooner.

shafa · Post by **shafa** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 12:21 pm

Thanks Vinny

really sorry for all of the questions but where do I write too-Can I email or by post only?

Post by **vinny** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 12:22 pm

Did the refusal letter have any contact address?

shafa · Post by **shafa** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 12:24 pm

no-The form does not have a contact details just mentions appeal

It was submitted in Lahore Gerrys

Post by **vinny** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 12:38 pm

Read the guidance and links above first.

Write to the ECM, Visa section, at

UK in Pakistan wrote:British High Commission
Diplomatic Enclave
Ramna 5
P O Box 1122
Islamabad

Cc Mr Adam Thomson.

If necessary, appeal before the deadline.

shafa · Post by **shafa** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 12:49 pm

thanks I will write to them and keep everyone posted

If I dont get a response after 20 days I will should I appeal or re-apply?

Post by **vinny** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 12:57 pm

If she wishes, she may do both.

shafa · Post by **shafa** » Wed May 09, 2012 12:24 pm

Hello could someone tell if this is the latest appeal form?

http://www.justice.gov.uk/downloads/for ... l-form.pdf

And you cant do it online from the UK?

many thanks

Shaf

shafa · Post by **shafa** » Tue Jun 12, 2012 5:32 pm

Hello can someone tell me who I can chase for an acknowledgement of the appeal?

I posted here in the UK

Is there an email, or telephone number I just want to check they received it

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Family Visitor Visa refusal 2nd time? shock?

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