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USA to UK Unmarried Partnership Visa

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DrDewlap
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USA to UK Unmarried Partnership Visa

Post by DrDewlap » Tue Aug 04, 2015 5:53 am

Hello!

Currently I have leave to enter the UK for six months, ending this September. My partner George and I have been together for 3 years now, and it'll be six months at his company in September, so we figured we'd file for the unmarried partnership visa as we can prove we have lived together physically for 2 years ( though visits, rent paid during that time, etc ), have a long standing relationship, and he earns over 18k. We have a bit in savings and are accomidated at George's parents house. His parent's house is a council house, however. Would this make difference?

Does this also mean I have to go back home and wait on a Visa? Or can I get one of those premium service ones that is decided on the same day?

I really appreciate any advice on this! It seems very difficult!

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Re: USA to UK Unmarried Partnership Visa

Post by Casa » Tue Aug 04, 2015 7:52 am

If you're in the UK on a visitor visa, then you can't switch to an Unmarried Partner visa without returning to your home country and applying from there. You can't apply from within the UK.
Before submitting the application ensure you have documented evidence of living together in a relationship 'akin to marriage' for the full 2 years. This should include evidence such as joint finances. In order for his parents' accommodation to be acceptable, you will have to submit a letter from the Council as the landlords agreeing to you living there and you will also have to provide proof that there will not be overcrowding if you join the household and that it will be considered 'adequate'.
Note: The minimum income level is £18,600. The visa fee is £956 + £600 NHS surcharge
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Re: USA to UK Unmarried Partnership Visa

Post by Wanderer » Tue Aug 04, 2015 7:57 am

DrDewlap wrote:Hello!

Currently I have leave to enter the UK for six months, ending this September. My partner George and I have been together for 3 years now, and it'll be six months at his company in September, so we figured we'd file for the unmarried partnership visa as we can prove we have lived together physically for 2 years ( though visits, rent paid during that time, etc ), have a long standing relationship, and he earns over 18k. We have a bit in savings and are accomidated at George's parents house. His parent's house is a council house, however. Would this make difference?

Does this also mean I have to go back home and wait on a Visa? Or can I get one of those premium service ones that is decided on the same day?

I really appreciate any advice on this! It seems very difficult!
Are you saying you've lived together in UK on visit visas for the whole 24 months?
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Re: USA to UK Unmarried Partnership Visa

Post by Casa » Tue Aug 04, 2015 9:10 am

I've been mulling over this Wanderer since I my reply this morning. DrDewlap have you included time spent visiting in your 2 year qualifying period? If so, this won't be considered as the mandatory 'co-habitation'. Also I'm confused with the comment 'at his company'. Do you mean you've been working with him?
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Re: USA to UK Unmarried Partnership Visa

Post by DrDewlap » Tue Aug 04, 2015 1:26 pm

Thanks so much for your replies!

Casa: He works for TFL, which is what I meant by his company. As for being together, it's a collective over the 3 years we've been together. We've got proof of rent and bills, tickets, and customs parcels with my name on it going to his parent's address. We don't have a joint bank account, but I can get some copies of British Gas payments and council tax in my name. There's also chat logs from Skype, Facebook and the like. Does this mean we couldn't get the premium service?

In addition, what if we got married? Is it possible to just get married and go back home, and file a spousal visa? George is a UK born citizen.

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Re: USA to UK Unmarried Partnership Visa

Post by Wanderer » Tue Aug 04, 2015 1:34 pm

For unmarried partner visa you have to have 24 months provable evidence of living together as man and wife, you can't really prove that if it's just 6 months a year in visits. If it's over that you've been overstaying and you don't want go down that road.

Plus the rules expressly forbid residing on visit visas, they are for visits for genuine visitors.

You can marry while here, though some eyebrows might be raised since you should be here on a Marriage Visit visa in that case.

Anyway, that should be ok, get married (if you can, they might not be enough time etc), return home and apply for spouse visa on form VAF4A, as far as I know there is no premium service available to you since you cannot apply from within the UK.
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Re: USA to UK Unmarried Partnership Visa

Post by DrDewlap » Tue Aug 04, 2015 1:43 pm

I see...wouldn't it be understood though that we couldn't spend the time together physically because of the 6 out of 12 month rule? On my Passport, it does document that I've been visiting too much, however the immigration officers still let me through because of my savings ( over 10k ) and my return ticket. Come 2015 and after I spent 7 months away, they let me pass no problem ( entering again with around 10k in savings that had remained stable for over 12 months and with a return ticket and private insurance ). So even with the passport dates which add up to a bit over 24 months of time together ( often in chunks of 4-6 months ), bills and mail sent to an address we were both living at which I could easily get a letter stating that it is uncrowded ( 5 people to the 3 bedrooms ), it's insufficient evidence to prove a longstanding relationship worthy of a visa?

If so, then it sounds like marriage is the better route. The only thing holding us back from marrying was saving up for a large wedding. What are the chances of me not getting a marriage visa? What would I have to prove, and how long would I be in the states for as it's processed? Would I have to include anything about where we were staying while here, or where George is staying when I'm overseas? He makes around 30k on a contract he can provide, and has good credit. He and his family are born UK citizens.

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Re: USA to UK Unmarried Partnership Visa

Post by Casa » Tue Aug 04, 2015 1:47 pm

DrDewlap wrote:Thanks so much for your replies!

Casa: He works for TFL, which is what I meant by his company. As for being together, it's a collective over the 3 years we've been together. We've got proof of rent and bills, tickets, and customs parcels with my name on it going to his parent's address. We don't have a joint bank account, but I can get some copies of British Gas payments and council tax in my name. There's also chat logs from Skype, Facebook and the like. Does this mean we couldn't get the premium service?

In addition, what if we got married? Is it possible to just get married and go back home, and file a spousal visa? George is a UK born citizen.

You can't count time spent living apart for your 2 year qualifying period. The care worker would consider this to be a girlfriend/boyfriend relationship or at best as an engaged couple. An unmarried partner application comes under a great deal of scrutiny and requires 24 months of co-habitation 'akin to marriage', i,e living at the same address with shared responsibilities that one would expect to see with marriage couples. It doesn't matter how often you spoke to each other while apart, or how many gifts you sent each other...this won't qualify.
Technically, you could marry, although the Home Office frown on this when you've entered as a visitor. Also in order to marry here without the appropriate visa, you would have to give notice to marry in a Home Office designated Registry Office and recently tightened regulations require the Registrar to notify the Home Office when the marriage involves a foreign national. The Home Office can then if they choose, extend the notification period from 28 to 70 days and interview the couple before the marriage can take place. As you say your current visa is due to expire in September, this is unlikely to leave you with enough time to go through the mandatory registration process. In addition, even if you were able to marry here, you would have to return to your home country to apply for a spouse visa as you can't switch from visitor from within the UK
Alternatively, you could return to the US, marry and then apply for a Spouse Settlement visa from there, or return to the US and apply for a fiance visa to return to the UK and marry here within 6 months. If you choose the latter, after the UK wedding you would have to apply in the UK for a 2.5 year FLR(M) extension.

Unfortunately, an Unmarried Partner application stands zero chance of success in your current situation.

Edit: As so often happens, Wanderer you beat me to it! :|
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Re: USA to UK Unmarried Partnership Visa

Post by Wanderer » Tue Aug 04, 2015 1:50 pm

UPV is my speciality, we got one 2009, and it was tough then, and we ticked all the boxes - be even tougher now....
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Re: USA to UK Unmarried Partnership Visa

Post by DrDewlap » Tue Aug 04, 2015 1:50 pm

That's just it, we're not counting time apart! I'm only counting the time I've spent with him physically and can prove that i've been with him physically for that time ( ie with the bills, the council tax, the mail, the tickets, my passport )

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Re: USA to UK Unmarried Partnership Visa

Post by Casa » Tue Aug 04, 2015 2:02 pm

There are two issues here.
1. It could be construed that you have been using your visitor visa with the intention to clock up time for an Unmarried Parter visa. The Home Office won't be happy with this as they could take the view that you haven't been a genuine 'visitor' As you've already said, your frequent visits here have already been flagged by Border officers and will be on your immigration record. Did you declare your relationship as a reason for your visits?

2. Unmarried Partner visas were originally introduced for couples who due to national law were unable to divorce from their previous spouses, but were living together in a relationship 'akin to marriage'. (The official term). The Philippines is a good example. This concession was later extended to all couples who were living together for a mandatory minimum of 2 years. Periods apart and periods together can't be totted up to meet the 24 month rule.
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Re: USA to UK Unmarried Partnership Visa

Post by Wanderer » Tue Aug 04, 2015 2:04 pm

DrDewlap wrote:That's just it, we're not counting time apart! I'm only counting the time I've spent with him physically and can prove that i've been with him physically for that time ( ie with the bills, the council tax, the mail, the tickets, my passport )
The 24 months is the last 24 months, obviously apart from holidays apart or the odd work away from home, hospital stays God forbid etc.

If you were here on a visit visa them you were visiting, not 'living', because that would be visa fraud anyway, and like I said, that's not a road you want to go down, and the test is 'living together...', not 'visiting with...'
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Re: USA to UK Unmarried Partnership Visa

Post by DrDewlap » Tue Aug 04, 2015 2:11 pm

Oh yes, the reason was stated at all times. I stated George was my fiance with the intent of staying with him for those months. On the landing card, there'd always be his parent's address.

Hmm..looks like it'll be impossible via Unmarried partnership visa. It's good to know this now, as we were told it'd be easy ( have a laugh) ! Thank you so so much for your information oof, this is so difficult it makes my head spin. If I may impose on you more ( and I apologize ):

1: So I go home in September and ignore the original UPV plan and file for a Fiance visa. Do I need proof with this? How long does it take to get, and would I have to wait six months before re-entering the UK again?

2. Upon getting the Fiance visa, I'd have six months to marry..then I switch to Spouse Settlement, correct? And that can be applied for within the UK. Looking on the immigration site, I can't find much other information than https://www.gov.uk/marriage-visa , so I do apologize if my questions are a bit dim. What documents would I need?

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Re: USA to UK Unmarried Partnership Visa

Post by Casa » Tue Aug 04, 2015 2:46 pm

DrDewlap wrote:Oh yes, the reason was stated at all times. I stated George was my fiance with the intent of staying with him for those months. On the landing card, there'd always be his parent's address.

Hmm..looks like it'll be impossible via Unmarried partnership visa. It's good to know this now, as we were told it'd be easy ( have a laugh) ! Thank you so so much for your information oof, this is so difficult it makes my head spin. If I may impose on you more ( and I apologize ):

1: So I go home in September and ignore the original UPV plan and file for a Fiance visa. Do I need proof with this? How long does it take to get, and would I have to wait six months before re-entering the UK again?

2. Upon getting the Fiance visa, I'd have six months to marry..then I switch to Spouse Settlement, correct? And that can be applied for within the UK. Looking on the immigration site, I can't find much other information than https://www.gov.uk/marriage-visa , so I do apologize if my questions are a bit dim. What documents would I need?
1. Yes. submit an application to enter as a fiance. You'll need documented evidence of finance; the most recent 6 months payslips/bank statement from your sponsor + letter from his employer on company headed paper confirming terms of his employment and salary. Evidence of your wedding being planned; quotes from venues/caterers etc. Proof of your relationship, although unlike a UPV application this doesn't have any time conditions.
https://www.gov.uk/join-family-in-uk/overview

2. Your fiance visa will expire in 6 months from the issue date, so you should be married and have submitted your FLR(M) application in the UK before this expires.
A straight forward fiance visa application submitted in the US shouldn't take more than 3-4 weeks to process if all your documentation is in order. If you submit copies of any documents, ensure you have them legally certified and this includes your fiance's passport. Online bank statements must be stamped and validated by the issuing bank. The most recent bank statement and pay slips should be no older than 28 days before the application is submitted. You'll need written confirmation from the Council to agree to you living in the property and a copy of the tenancy agreement.
The fiance visa fee will be £956. The subsequent FLR(M) visa will be £649 if applied for by post, or £1049 if applied for in person at a PSC. In addition your will need to pay the NHS surcharge of £500 online before submitting your FLR(M) application. Bear in mind that you will be unable to work legally in the UK until your FLR(M) visa has been granted. Postal applications can take around 8 weeks to process, whereas an application submitted in person for the premium fee is generally decided on the same day.

Make sure you don't apply for a 'Marriage Visit visa' by mistake. This is for someone who doesn't intend to settle in the UK after the wedding.
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Please don't send me PMs asking for immigration advice on posts that are on the open forum. If I haven't responded there, it's because I don't have the answer. I'm a moderator, not a legal professional.

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Re: USA to UK Unmarried Partnership Visa

Post by DrDewlap » Tue Aug 04, 2015 2:55 pm

Casa wrote:
DrDewlap wrote:Oh yes, the reason was stated at all times. I stated George was my fiance with the intent of staying with him for those months. On the landing card, there'd always be his parent's address.

Hmm..looks like it'll be impossible via Unmarried partnership visa. It's good to know this now, as we were told it'd be easy ( have a laugh) ! Thank you so so much for your information oof, this is so difficult it makes my head spin. If I may impose on you more ( and I apologize ):

1: So I go home in September and ignore the original UPV plan and file for a Fiance visa. Do I need proof with this? How long does it take to get, and would I have to wait six months before re-entering the UK again?

2. Upon getting the Fiance visa, I'd have six months to marry..then I switch to Spouse Settlement, correct? And that can be applied for within the UK. Looking on the immigration site, I can't find much other information than https://www.gov.uk/marriage-visa , so I do apologize if my questions are a bit dim. What documents would I need?
1. Yes. submit an application to enter as a fiance. You'll need documented evidence of finance; the most recent 6 months payslips/bank statement from your sponsor + letter from his employer on company headed paper confirming terms of his employment and salary. Evidence of your wedding being planned; quotes from venues/caterers etc. Proof of your relationship, although unlike a UPV application this doesn't have any time conditions.
https://www.gov.uk/join-family-in-uk/overview

2. Your fiance visa will expire in 6 months from the issue date, so you should be married and have submitted your FLR(M) application in the UK before this expires.
A straight forward fiance visa application submitted in the US shouldn't take more than 3-4 weeks to process if all your documentation is in order. If you submit copies of any documents, ensure you have them legally certified and this includes your fiance's passport. Online bank statements must be stamped and validated by the issuing bank. The most recent bank statement and pay slips should be no older than 28 days before the application is submitted. You'll need written confirmation from the Council to agree to you living in the property and a copy of the tenancy agreement.
The fiance visa fee will be £956. The subsequent FLR(M) visa will be £649 if applied for by post, or £1049 if applied for in person at a PSC. In addition your will need to pay the NHS surcharge of £500 online before submitting your FLR(M) application. Bear in mind that you will be unable to work legally in the UK until your FLR(M) visa has been granted. Postal applications can take around 8 weeks to process, whereas an application submitted in person for the premium fee is generally decided on the same day.

Make sure you don't apply for a 'Marriage Visit visa' by mistake. This is for someone who doesn't intend to settle in the UK after the wedding.
Casa, Wanderer, thank you. Thank you so much. I don't know what to say other than thank you, from the bottom of my heart. We've been struggling with this, and having thought we had a plan, were devastated to learn that it wasn't the right one and our efforts were thrown in the wrong direction, it's good to know that we've got a straight path now!

Just to be clear, upon arriving home, and filing for the Fiance visa, I don't have to wait 6 months before coming back to the UK? I'd have been in the UK Mid April-mid September, so my 6 of 12 months would be up. Would this affect the visa at all? In addition, what is an FLR(M), ?

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Re: USA to UK Unmarried Partnership Visa

Post by Casa » Tue Aug 04, 2015 3:00 pm

No, you don't need to wait before submitting your application. This has no relevance to your recent time in the UK as a visitor as it's a different visa category. :)
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Re: USA to UK Unmarried Partnership Visa

Post by vinny » Tue Aug 04, 2015 3:02 pm

FLR(M) is an application form for leave to remain as a partner of a settled/British person.
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Re: USA to UK Unmarried Partnership Visa

Post by DrDewlap » Tue Aug 04, 2015 3:04 pm

Oh my gosh thank goodness! I was worried I'd have to spend a half a year away again! It's really crippling!

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Re: USA to UK Unmarried Partnership Visa

Post by Wanderer » Tue Aug 04, 2015 3:06 pm

You could also marry in USA (since it's so easy and you can on visit visa/waiver) and apply for Spouse visa directly, saving the Fiancee visa fee (but costing a return flight for your partner/husband).

That one's a tricky balance since there's very little in which is most efficient but the end result is the same.
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Re: USA to UK Unmarried Partnership Visa

Post by DrDewlap » Thu Aug 06, 2015 6:28 pm

Sorry to ressurect this thread with stupid questions but..the Marriage Visitor visa says I shouldn't intend to stay in the country after I've married. Does that mean I can't an FLR(M), and would be treated like a visitor?

Edit: My understanding is this is the fiance visa: https://www.gov.uk/join-family-in-uk/apply , and then I file this afterwards: https://www.gov.uk/remain-in-uk-family/apply . Is that correct?

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Re: USA to UK Unmarried Partnership Visa

Post by CR001 » Thu Aug 06, 2015 7:19 pm

A marriage visitor visa is purely to get married in the UK and then leave. You cannot switch to any other category while in the UK on this visa. It is a visitor visa.

The one you should be reading up on or looking at is the Fiance Visa. This allows you to marry in the UK and then switch to FLR(M) spouse visa. Bear in mind that you are not allowed to work while on a Fiance Visa. Fiance visa is part of the settlement/spouse visa bundle.
Edit: My understanding is this is the fiance visa: https://www.gov.uk/join-family-in-uk/apply , and then I file this afterwards: https://www.gov.uk/remain-in-uk-family/apply . Is that correct?
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