UK citizen with RSA partner emigrating to Ireland

[mcdonald.raymond]

I am a British Passport holder living in South Africa (dual citizenship - RSA & UK) and I am looking to emigrate to the Republic of Ireland at the end of this year or early next year (2017) with my girlfriend (South African passport holder). Our plan is to travel to Northern Ireland in December in order to attend my cousins wedding in Ballymena on December 31st and then travel down to Dublin in January and begin searching for jobs and accommodation. I am an Occupational Health and Safety Professional consulting within the construction sector in Southern Africa and my girlfriend is a Beauty Therapist, therefore we are very confident of landing employment with very good salary packages once we are settled. South Africans do not require visas to enter the Republic of Ireland and as far as I understand, I can travel freely into Ireland and have the right to employment and residence in Ireland.

We are having lots of trouble trying to figure out how we will be able to get into the Republic of Ireland and be able to have her be able to search for jobs and work immediately. South Africans do not require visas to enter the Republic of Ireland and, as far as I understand, I can travel freely into Ireland and have the right to employment and residence in Ireland. What will be the procedure we need to follow in order for her to gain the right to work as soon as possible? Thank you in advance for any feedback you may have - we are desperate for some concrete advice as we want to get out of South Africa as soon as we can.

[noajthan]

Suggest start here:
http://ec.europa.eu/justice/citizen/doc ... 013_en.pdf

[Casa]

Do bear in mind that the current level of unemployment in Eire is higher than in the UK. Eire @ 9.7% - UK @ 5.1%
We've had several reports recently of forum member being unable to find work. You may want to consider which areas of the Country have more opportunities for the skills you both have to offer employers.

[CR001]

Our plan is to travel to Northern Ireland in December in order to attend my cousins wedding in Ballymena on December 31st and then travel down to Dublin in January and begin searching for jobs and accommodation.

She will need a UK visitor visa for Northern Ireland and if she cannot show 'strong ties to SA' and intention to return, she might not get a visitor visa.

[mcdonald.raymond]

The unemployment rate in RSA is currently 25% so we are all too familiar with the stresses of job searching. The visa to enter the UK is not an issue, the process is easy and quick on this side. We are concerned with when we arrive in the Republic of Ireland itself - where must we go? What must we do? I will either get a job before the time we arrive or I will be going to interviews once we are there but how long will it take before she can begin the job hunt in earnest and once she finds suitable employment, not have any hassle in terms of work permits etc?

[CR001]

The visa to enter the UK is not an issue, the process is easy and quick on this side.

Not as easy as it used to be I am afraid. What will she show as proof of her strong ties to SA to convince the ECO she will leave the UK and that she is a 'genuine visitor'? How will she provide proof of employment if she is leaving SA?

South Africa might have a higher unemployment rate, but they don't have most of certain EU and other Countries landing on their shores looking for work.

You will be competing for jobs with highly skilled people that have attained British citizenship and moved to Ireland for certain reasons. Even highly skilled now British (previously different nationality) people are struggling to find employment.

It really isn't as easy as it seems and the weather is kak. You will likely have to take very menial jobs if you can find them.

[noajthan]

...

You will be competing for jobs with highly skilled people that have attained British citizenship and moved to Ireland for certain reasons. Even highly skilled now British (previously different nationality) people are struggling to find employment.

It really isn't as easy as it seems and the weather is kak. You will likely have to take very menial jobs if you can find them.

Alternately suggest shoot for somewhere like Malta:

• Anglophile & English-speaking;
  great climate;
  seasonal touristm plus gaming industry sectors;

[mcdonald.raymond]

It really isn't as easy as it seems and the weather is kak. You will likely have to take very menial jobs if you can find them.

We are trying to remain as positive as possible about this move as it is a big decision for us which could potentially change our lives for the better and we would appreciate more positive feedback. Judging by your comment I gather you are South African yourself, therefore you understand our plight. All of the researching I have been doing into the availability of work there as well as the salary packages for my industry and sector have proved very positive so I must admit that your unreasonably pessimistic response surprises me.

If anyone else has some constructive advice they could offer it would be highly appreciated.

[Casa]

With respect, by passing on feedback we have been receiving recently on the forum from members going through this re-settlement process in Eire (Surinder Singh route), I felt this was being constructive.
I'll leave all those with success stories to respond.

[CR001]

It really isn't as easy as it seems and the weather is kak. You will likely have to take very menial jobs if you can find them.

We are trying to remain as positive as possible about this move as it is a big decision for us which could potentially change our lives for the better and we would appreciate more positive feedback. Judging by your comment I gather you are South African yourself, therefore you understand our plight. All of the researching I have been doing into the availability of work there as well as the salary packages for my industry and sector have proved very positive so I must admit that your unreasonably pessimistic response surprises me.

If anyone else has some constructive advice they could offer it would be highly appreciated.

I am a South African yes, made the move 7.5 years ago but to London. Even we had to take menial jobs in London when we arrived. I have based my comments on people who have posted on the forum searching for months and months for jobs in Ireland. The point I am trying to make is that you won't necessarily land a great job and would likely have to start lower than you are now and work your way up again. We don't sugar coat things, we tell it as it is. You might be fortunate and find a decent job, no one can say. Your biggest hurdle at the moment, in my opinion, is the visitor visa for your girlfriend (and the currency not being in your favour).

[noajthan]

@rajreading you have hijacked 12 or more threads with your questions today.
You have already been warned about this twice today.

You already have your own thread in place so continue with your questions in your own thread.

And kindly read the Board T&Cs so you understand how the forum works.

[CR001]

With respect, by passing on feedback we have been receiving recently on the forum from members going through this re-settlement process in Eire (Surinder Singh route), I felt this was being constructive.
I'll leave all those with success stories to respond.

Can't please everyone with what they would like to hear can we Casa Almost 8 years here and I still find it hard sometimes, ex hubby has never settled, hence why he is going back to SA now (mad I know).

[CR001]

@rajreading you have hijacked 12 or more threads with your questions today.
You have already been warned about this twice today.

You already have your own thread in place so continue with your questions in your own thread.

And kindly read the Board T&Cs so you understand how the forum works.

Sorry, deleted it before I realised you were responding to the perpetual forum T&Cs ignorami.

[Casa]

@CR001 @noajthan As the OP and his SA girlfriend are unmarried, how do the Immigration authorities assess a 'durable relationship' akin to marriage? More or less flexible than the view currently being taken by the UKVI here where 2 years co-habitation is expected under the EU route?
I was caught napping the other day when I missed the fact that France for example don't issue residence permits to an unmarried partner.

I note this, but wonder what qualifies as 'duly attested'?
"As Irish legislation does not treat registered partnerships as equivalent to marriage Ireland is not be obliged to recognise registered partners as family members. However, Ireland is obliged to facilitate the entry and residence of the partner with whom the Union citizen has a durable relationship, duly attested. In doing so an extensive examination of the personal circumstances of such relations must be undertaken."

[CR001]

@CR001 @noajthan As the OP and his SA girlfriend are unmarried, how do the Immigration authorities assess a 'durable relationship' akin to marriage? More or less flexible than the view currently being taken by the UKVI here where 2 years co-habitation is expected under the EU route?
I was caught napping the other day when I missed the fact that France for example don't issue residence permits to an unmarried partner.

I note this, but wonder what qualifies as 'duly attested'?
"As Irish legislation does not treat registered partnerships as equivalent to marriage Ireland is not be obliged to recognise registered partners as family members. However, Ireland is obliged to facilitate the entry and residence of the partner with whom the Union citizen has a durable relationship, duly attested. In doing so an extensive examination of the personal circumstances of such relations must be undertaken."

Good question Casa and the thought of 'durable relationship' did cross my mind. Given that Ireland is creating the delays in the SS route C visas per the link further down the main Ireland page with the backlog of almost 7000 visas being issued (I think), they must have something fairly stringent in place to check and cross check relationships to limit abuse otherwise it could be open season for all then who have a 'partner'.

[Casa]

It really isn't as easy as it seems and the weather is kak. You will likely have to take very menial jobs if you can find them.

We are trying to remain as positive as possible about this move as it is a big decision for us which could potentially change our lives for the better and we would appreciate more positive feedback. Judging by your comment I gather you are South African yourself, therefore you understand our plight. All of the researching I have been doing into the availability of work there as well as the salary packages for my industry and sector have proved very positive so I must admit that your unreasonably pessimistic response surprises me.

If anyone else has some constructive advice they could offer it would be highly appreciated.

You may find this link constructive:
https://eumovement.wordpress.com/eu-cou ... o-ireland/

[mcdonald.raymond]

Thank you all for your input. Please try not to misinterpret my defensiveness as aggression, I have just grown frustrated at the lack of guidance I could find up to this point. I assure you that we are not so naive that we imagine we will land in another country and have work opportunities thrown at us and everything will be easy as pie - but we have to try and believe that there is some opportunity outside of South Africa for us, I'm sure you can sympathize with that...?

So would it be realistic to say that we could travel over, visit the Garda office once there and notify them of our presence/ fill out all necessary administration and at such times as I can find work then apply for the subsequent permission for her to work as well?

P.S. Would it just all be easier if we were married?

[CR001]

We are only telling you the realities. My husband pushed trolleys at IKEA as his first job here, was all he could get at the time. In SA he was a Retail Warehouse Manager. Most of us are talking from experience too, not just on 'heresay'.

Yes it will be better, but is is difficult and takes a lot of effort and perseverance and time.

It would be much easier if you were married yes.

[Casa]

Reading through the passage I posted earlier on how the Irish Immigration Service view unmarried partnerships, in my opinion the application would be stronger if you were married.
However, CR001 is absolutely right when she says that the first (and perhaps the biggest hurdle) will be to convince the Case Worker assessing the UK visitor visa application that she has strong ties to South Africa, when her actual intention is to settle. The CW will be looking for either permanent employment, long term study, property ownership in SA or dependent relatives. You'll have to consider how you will get around this. She will also be expected to produce a return ticket for the Immigration Officer at the Port of Entry in NI.

[noajthan]

If OP has a challenge with procuring a UK visit visa then suggest to forego the family wedding in N.Ireland & parachute directy into the Emerald Isle (visa free).

As UK is in the CTA it may then be easier to pop over to N.Ireland for the wedding just for an afternoon ie going from a base in Eire.
(Not sure if the CTA applies to non-UK/non-Eire citizens though).

And, yes, marriage would simplify everything as the spouse would then be a direct family member of their sponsor (rather than extended family member with all that 'akin to marriage' nonsense).

[CR001]

Reading through the passage I posted earlier on how the Irish Immigration Service view unmarried partnerships, in my opinion the application would be stronger if you were married.
However, CR001 is absolutely right when she says that the first (and perhaps the biggest hurdle) will be to convince the Case Worker assessing the UK visitor visa application that she has strong ties to South Africa, when her actual intention is to settle. The CW will be looking for either permanent employment, long term study, property ownership in SA or dependent relatives. You'll have to consider how you will get around this. She will also be expected to produce a return ticket for the Immigration Officer at the Port of Entry in NI.

+1 on what Casa says. By return ticket, they mean 'return to South Africa'. Please also bear in mind that the UK and Republic of Ireland share immigration data (refusals, appeals, approvals etc).