Question about worker (no WRS) vs student (no CSI) status

[Brexitsucks]

Hello

I would like to resurrect this thread as I am concerned there may have been a change in law, or the position today could be different for some other reason.

I am in a very similar situation to the person with the original question.

The 2 main pieces of advices I have found for myself in responses are as follows:

(1) "With regards to the health insurance, if you have worked (with WRS authorisation), then health insurance is not required for period under employment." (by Jambo)

(2) "Don't mention student in the application form just apply with P60 and payslips and prove that you worked continuously for 5 years after WRS registration" (by askmeplz82)

Which advice is best to follow -- (1) or (2)? If (1) is followed, then one should state that he was a student and not be concerned that comprehensive insurance is required.

With regard to advice (1), if possible, please explain what your conclusion is based on (and if it, for example, a provision in law, or a guidance, please provide specific reference with Act/Guide title and provision number). It seems to be that the application is quite unequivocal in requesting to provide details of comprehensive insurance for any period an applicant was a student and does not make any exceptions. (See section 9.7 of the application EEA(PR): "For any period in which you were ... a student ... indicate below you met the requirement to hold comprehensive sickness insurance cover.").

With regard to advice (2), I came to the UK in 2005 and became a student, but I started to work in 2007. In the application, I need to state the date I first arrived to the UK. So it will be 2005. If I do not state that I was a student, then there will be an unexplained gap of 2 years. Does not this jeopardise my application? The application unequivocally requests to account for the period when an applicant was a student (See sections 9.5 and 9.6 of the application EEA(PR):"For any period in which you were ... a student ... please give details in the table below" and "... state what financial resources were available to you. Indicate the source of the income (for example ... income from lawful employment...)" ).

[noajthan]

To avoid confusion with an obsolete thread & jumbled responses, I have moved your question to its own thread (this one).

[noajthan]

All you need to refer to and read is the Directive and their transposition into UK's EEA Regulations.
You can google all that as well as other members can.

You appear to have several misunderstandings here.
You are not applying for a visa. And its not called EEA3 anymore.

You (or any applicant) do not have to Spammy Spammer your information or clean it up to present a good story (even if an applicant knows what that is).

Applicants are not penalised, for example for not having WRS as an A8 worker in/before 2011. (Although technically their employer committed an offence).
Nor penalised as a student without the foresight to procure CSI.

If a worker all that is strictly necessary is to show the work was genuine and effective rather than marginal and supplementary.
UK HO does ofcourse now apply its somewhat controversial PET/MET tests on top of the cleaner, purer EU law.
Still waiting for a champion to challenge that.

The process is binary: meet requirements to show you have acquired PR automatically and confirmatory DCPR is granted.
Fail to meet requirements (or submit inadequate documentary supporting proof): confirmatory DCPR refused.

[Brexitsucks]

Hello

I am an EU (Latvian) national, and my ultimate goal it to get a UK passport. I understand, first I need to get a document certifying permanent residence.

Please assume the following facts:

2005 (Sep): I arrived to the UK to study.
2006 (Jan): I temporarily discontinued my studies and moved to Ireland where I work full-time until.
2006 (Sep): I returned to the UK to start my studies afreash.
2006 (Sep) - 2009 (Jun): I studied on full-time basis towards a bachelor's degree.
2010 (Jan) - 2012 (Jan): I studied on part-time basis towards a master's degree.
When I first came to the UK, I had a comprehensive sickness insurance, but I cannot find any proof of it now. I do not remember when it expired, but probably it lasted 5 years and expired in 2010.

2007 (Feb) - 2011 (Jul): I had a part-time job. (I worked full-time during summer holidays and from June 2009 until January 2010).
2011 (July) - 2013 (Sep): I had a full-time job
2013 (Sep) - 2014 (Jun): I studied towards a professional qualification. I had not job. Please assume, I had no comprehensive sickness insurance.
2014 (Jun) - present: full time employemnt.

If I cannot find a proof of comprehensive sickness insurance that I arived with to the Uk in 2005 and that was valid for at least 5 years when I was a student, I understand, I cannot apply for a document certifying permanent residence as a student.

If I did not have a comprehensive sickness insurance when I was a student in 2013-2014, I understand that I cannot submit an application that would invcude 2013-2014 as the relevant period.

When I was a student from 2006 to 2012, I was employed. I undertsnad, I can use any 5 years of this employment (e.g. 2007-2012) to apply on the basis of being a worker,.

(1) The main question I have is whether I still need to prove that I had a comprehensive sickness insurance in the relevant period. Common sense tells me I do not need to prove it, because I apply on the basis of being a worker rather than a student.

However fromo the text of the application form, it seems that it requires me to show that I had a comprehensive sickness insurance. See section 9.7 of the application EEA(PR): "For any period in which you were ... a student ... indicate below you met the requirement to hold comprehensive sickness insurance cover."

(2) The second questions is whether I need to mentioned in my application that I was a student. On the one hand, I am applying on the basis of being a worker, and the fact that I was also a student is probably irrelevant. On the other hand, the application form appears to require to state that I was a student. See sections 9.5 and 9.6 of the application EEA(PR):"For any period in which you were ... a student ... please give details in the table below" and "... state what financial resources were available to you. Indicate the source of the income (for example ... income from lawful employment...". See also section 9.4 which requires to account for my activities in the UK. If I do not mentioned that I was a student, there will be a gap in section 9.4, i.e. a period for which I will provide no explanation as to my activity in the UK (i.e. from 2005 or 2006, depending on what should be treated as the date I first arrived to the UK, to 2007 when I got a job)

(3) The third question is what date I have to state as the date when I first arrived to the UK.

I would be most grateful for a specific advice in relation to three question above.

If however from the facts above, you see that there is an alternative route for me to get a document certifying permanent residence, and then the UK passport, I would be grateful if you could point me in the right direction.

[noajthan]

To avoid confusion & jumbled responses, I have moved your question to its own thread (this one).

[noajthan]

Just fill in the form with various timelines for various activities as per questions.
Don't Spammy Spammer or suppress info to make a good, clean storyline (you may get it wrong).
Caseworker will figure out.

Your 9 month sojourn in Eire is a potential problem.
Your lack of CSI is a problem (or lost proof of CSI).

Work needs to be genuine and effective not marginal and supplementary to something else eg being a student.

HO also, and somewhat controversially, applies its PET/MET test to assess work too;
(that test is above and beyond the cleaner, purer EU law).
Parttime work may or may not pass muster.

It also appears that you did not register fully and properly for WRS so you should disregard any/all work before May 2011.

Worst case: your PR clock started (as a full-time worker) in 2014. If UK is still in EU you may acquire PR in 2019.

In the meantime if you do not have EEA(QP) RC suggest you apply for one.
This could pay off to invoke any transitional arrangements that may be put in place for Brexit; (these are yet TBC ofcourse).

You first arrrived in UK in 2005.
To achieve the holy grail of a British passport you first need to apply for the privilege of citizenship (after obtaining DCPR).

[Brexitsucks]

noajthan, I do have WRS which I received when I got my first job in th UK.

Do you suggest I should get both EEA(QP) RC and DCPR? Why do I need both?

[noajthan]

noajthan, I do have WRS which I received when I got my first job in th UK.

Do you suggest I should get both EEA(QP) RC and DCPR? Why do I need both?

I mean apply for RC if you don't yet qualify for DCPR.
Do you mean you have valid WRS dating from, is it, 2007?

[Brexitsucks]

Yes, I have WRS. I got it in 2006. Does this change your reasoning with regard to my chances of getting the document certifying permanent residence based on my employment from 2007 to 2012?

(I think it would make it easier for other people to understand what the thread is about and follow it if it could be renamed to "EEA (PR) - permanent residence - comprehensive insurance", and the first message replaced by the one where I state the relevant dates and facts.)

[noajthan]

Good that you have WRS.
I think you originally posted in someone else's thread and inherited their slightly misleading subject title.
A lesson there for all of us.

However 2 problem areas remain.
1)You were away too long in Eire.

2) As you didn't have CSI during carefree student years you will have to convince HO your parttime work whilst a student passes EU law (not marginal or supplementary) as well as UK PET/MET test.

Can you make it?

[Brexitsucks]

1) why does it matter how long I was in Ireland in 2005-2006 if I want to rely on my 5 years of employment from 2007 to 2012? I'm even happy to say that I entered the UK in 2006, i.e. after Ireland. By the way, "date you first entered the UK" do they mean when I first visited the UK (e.g. visiting the UK as a tourist) or do they mean when I entered the UK to reside here permanently?

2) In order for me to understand if I satsfy EU law (not marginal or supplementary work) as well as UK PET/MET test, I need to know the criteria. Could you please let me know where each of them is defined?

[noajthan]

1) why does it matter how long I was in Ireland in 2005-2006 if I want to rely on my 5 years of employment from 2007 to 2012? I'm even happy to say that I entered the UK in 2006, i.e. after Ireland. By the way, "date you first entered the UK" do they mean when I first visited the UK (e.g. visiting the UK as a tourist) or do they mean when I entered the UK to reside here permanently?

2) In order for me to understand if I satsfy EU law (not marginal or supplementary work) as well as UK PET/MET test, I need to know the criteria. Could you please let me know where each of them is defined?

1) First means first.

Yes you can count from after Irish gig.

2)
Get up to speed on worker qp here:
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... _clean.pdf

For PET see: https://www.freemovement.org.uk/using-m ... ne-worker/