Masters Degree, Exercising Treaty Rights, Sickness Insurance

[modamo]

Hi all,

So this is my situation:

- I am an EEA national and moved to the UK in 2004 with my parents when I was still in school. I have lived in the UK for almost 12 years now.

- I have finished my degree and started working in June 2015. I have never had comprehensive sickness insurance and wasn't aware that this was necessery.

- My non-EEA spouse moved to the UK in Feb 2015 to live with me.

- I am hoping to start my 1 year masters degree in September 2016, and I might have to leave my job to do this.

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My questions are:

1. I am hoping to get British Citizenship. If I do my masters now will it break my 5 year continuous period of exercising treaty rights? If so, when I start work after my masters does it mean I have to work for another 5 years CONTINUOUSLY in order to apply for British Citizenship?

2. Do I need to get comprehensive sickness insurance while I do my Masters?

Thanks a lot!

[ohara]

How old were you when you moved here with your parents? Depending on their economic activity, you may have already acquired PR as their dependent.

[modamo]

I was 12 when I moved here. I completed high school, then college, then my University. Since then (Jun 2015) I have been working and am hoping to start my Masters this coming September.

[noajthan]

I was 12 when I moved here. I completed high school, then college, then my University. Since then (Jun 2015) I have been working and am hoping to start my Masters this coming September.

As member ohara has intimated its likely you have acquired the holy grail of PR already.

Did you have an EEA parent/sponsor residing in UK and exercising treaty rights as a qualified person (continuously, for 5 years of more)?
and preferably while you were under age 21.

Do you have rock-solid documentary supporting evidence to prove this?

Have you (and/or such a sponsor) enjoyed any prolonged absences from UK?
Is sponsor from an A8 country?

As to questions:
1) No, not if you alresady have PR as no neeed to xercise treaty rights once you have settled status.

2) See 1

Ofcourse if you don't have PR yet you will need CSI in place (for you and any family dependents) if you want university years to keep the PR clock running and so to count towards acquiring PR.

[modamo]

My parent has recently applied for a PR card and has been exercising treaty rights continuously for the past 5 and a half years or so, and should hopefully get the card within the next month or so. In the 5 year period I would have been 18-23 years old. Is this still ok?

Yes, there is solid evidence of my parent's 5 year period of exercising treaty rights.

My parent has not had very long absences, no more than 2 months or so per year on average. I did have 1 year absence from the UK as part of my university course where I did a sandwich year and worked in Belgium. That was in Summer 2013 - Summer 2014. I got paid for the work but was not classed as an employee but an intern. Apart from that I have not been away from the UK in any year for more than 1 month. Is this ok?

My parent and I are not from A8 country and both have Dutch passports.

Please let me know what you think... Thanks!

[noajthan]

If over 21 you need to show financial dependency on parent/sponsor.

Can you not find an earlier period when you were under 21 (& no long absence)?
Eg when you were at school; it doesn't have to be last 5 years.

If away from UK for up to one year you need evidence to justify an exceptional reason if absence falls in qualifying period.

As you are not A8, at least there's no WRS nonsense to worry about.

[modamo]

From 18-22 years old I was getting Student Finance while I was at University (apart from one year while I was working abroad and getting paid) so would I still be classed as dependent on parents in that time frame? I started working a week or two after I finished uni.

I will ask about the 5 year period while I was at school but I am not sure at the moment.

Some other questions have also come to mind now:

- what if after I finish my Masters I cannot find a job for 1 month or a few months and so will be unemployed, will this break my 5 year period?

- I have read about CSI and to me it seems like I can just get any health insurance from a company that offer comprehensive insurance. Is this correct?

Many thanks!

[ohara]

You are still classed as a worker if you are a jobseeker - you should register with the jobcentre and make sure you have some proofs that you are actively looking for employment.

It doesn't matter who you have health insurance from as long as it is comprehensive.

[noajthan]

From 18-22 years old I was getting Student Finance while I was at University (apart from one year while I was working abroad and getting paid) so would I still be classed as dependent on parents in that time frame? I started working a week or two after I finished uni.

If sponsored by a parent whilst under age 21 no proof of dependency is required.

At over age 21, proof of dependency is required if you are to make the case that they are your sponsor. It doesn't have to be 100% dependency.

[modamo]

Thanks for the replies guys.

If I were to take out comprehensive health insurance for 1 year does my non-EEA spouse have to do the same in order for us to get PR and not break the 5 year period? My spouse is dependent on me.

If I get CSI does that mean I can no longer use the NHS at all? How would I go to my GP for a prescription for example? What about my spouse?

Thanks!

[noajthan]

Thanks for the replies guys.

If I were to take out comprehensive health insurance for 1 year does my non-EEA spouse have to do the same in order for us to get PR and not break the 5 year period? My spouse is dependent on me.

If I get CSI does that mean I can no longer use the NHS at all? How would I go to my GP for a prescription for example? What about my spouse?

Thanks!

If you take out CSI as a student then yes, any dependent neeeds cover too.

CSI is not about getting healthcare; its about ticking the boxes to acquire PR and DCPR.
If you need healthcare just carry on as you do now; presumably you're registered with local GP, dentist, optician & etc.
Ordinarlly resident EEA families can use NHS.

[modamo]

Thanks for the response noajthan.

Would my 5 year period break if my spouse does not have CSI and I do while I am a student?

Does my spouse need CSI cover for my PR application or only for their application?

This is getting quite complicated!

[noajthan]

Thanks for the response noajthan.

Would my 5 year period break if my spouse does not have CSI and I do while I am a student?

Does my spouse need CSI cover for my PR application or only for their application?

This is getting quite complicated!

Are you applying in own right and sponsoring your spouse?
If so, yes spouse needs CSI cover too if you are applying as a student qualified person.

Or are you applying as the dependent of someone? (Union citizen/parent)

And why are you not applying for confirmation of your PR (at least) from an earlier period (under 21, as a dependent)?

If you have do PR status (from younger years), you can now sponsor your spouse regardless of exercising treaty rights (so no need for anyone to have CSI),

[modamo]

I am not applying yet, I have only worked for 1 year and am now hoping to do Masters for 1 year and then work for 3 years and then I will apply for PR card and then British Citizenship.

Hopefully me and my spouse will apply at the same time in 4 years time.

I don't think I have PR from younger years, my father has recentlh applied for PR card based on the past 5 years.

If I were to study part time and work part time would I still need CSI for me and my spouse? It wouldnt break my 5 year period would it?

[noajthan]

I am not applying yet, I have only worked for 1 year and am now hoping to do Masters for 1 year and then work for 3 years and then I will apply for PR card and then British Citizenship.

Hopefully me and my spouse will apply at the same time in 4 years time.

I don't think I have PR from younger years, my father has recentlh applied for PR card based on the past 5 years.

If I were to study part time and work part time would I still need CSI for me and my spouse? It wouldnt break my 5 year period would it?

So for now get CSI in place for you and spouse. That's the only way to keep the PR clock running so that your upcoming student years could be used to help acquire PR.

But you won't acquire PR in normal way as you are now unlikely to have 4 years time before UK is gone from EU.

If you really haven't acquired PR then you will now have to rely on the traditional British sense of fair play and any transitional arrangements (ta) to be put in place; (if any - all yet TBC).
So for now, suggest apply for your EEA(QP) and EEA(FM) as such a ta often depends on holding EU documents by some critical date; (again yet TBC).

However the chances are you have acquired PR automatically as a child if one of your parents was working continuously for 5 years at that time.

Just because your father has (possibly mistakenly) simply used activity over the last 5 years to apply for his confirmation of PR doesn't mean he (and possibly you) didn't acquire automatically PR 'donkeys years' ago.

It could be worth a punt (after all, only £65) to apply for DCPR and see if you are confirmed;
(that is, if you can pull together adequate evidence from 'back in the day').

This is why its important to supply all the facts and timelines in an application and let the caseworker do their magic.

If you study parttime and also work parttime you will only be considered a worker if the work is shown to be genuine and effective (as per EU law).
HO will also apply its PET/MET test to decide if it agrees you are a worker.
If you get it wrong (and don't have CSI) your time as 'student' will be forfeit.

[modamo]

Thanks noajthan, your posts are always very informative.

I have spoken with my manager and they agreed that I can work part time while I do my Masters.

I work full time at the moment but will probably end up working 3 or 4 days per week Mon - Fri and also study 1/2 days per week. This is actually quite a relief as I was hesitant to leave my job for a postgraduate course.

If this is the case I think I don't need the have CSI for me or my spouse as I am paying tax from my job? Is there anything else that I need to have or do if I am a part time student and also work at the same time?

[noajthan]

Thanks noajthan, your posts are always very informative.

I have spoken with my manager and they agreed that I can work part time while I do my Masters.

I work full time at the moment but will probably end up working 3 or 4 days per week Mon - Fri and also study 1/2 days per week. This is actually quite a relief as I was hesitant to leave my job for a postgraduate course.

If this is the case I think I don't need the have CSI for me or my spouse as I am paying tax from my job? Is there anything else that I need to have or do if I am a part time student and also work at the same time?

Workers don't need CSI. If you are classed as a worker.

As above, If you study parttime and also work parttime you will only be considered a worker if the work is shown to be genuine and effective (as per EU law).
HO will also apply its PET/MET test to decide if it agrees you are a worker.
If you get it wrong (and don't have CSI) your time as 'student' (by default) will be forfeit.

And if you already have acquired PR status, from younger days (sponsored by parent) you don't need to exercise treaty rights anymore.

[modamo]

I have read that 'genuine and effective' is quite vague but means that you should work 18 + hours per week and get paid around £160 / week, which is the amount that triggers national insurance contributions.

Have I understood this correctly or is this misinformation?

[noajthan]

I have read that 'genuine and effective' is quite vague but means that you should work 18 + hours per week and get paid around £160 / week, which is the amount that triggers national insurance contributions.

Have I understood this correctly or is this misinformation?

Its the UK that has wrapped its PET/MET tests (originally used to assess benefits claimants) around the cleaner, purer EU law.

This approach is not compatible with EU law but what can anyone do in the prevailing climate.

Not sure on the specifics of current limits.

You seem to be steering clear of applying for DCPR based on younger years.
Is there a reason for that?
- considering that you could well have acquired PR 'back in the day'.