False marriage

[in_trouble]

Hello,

I married a woman in Pakistan in the last year and came back to UK. She sent me thousands of text messages and made hundred of whatsapp calls to let me know how much she loves me and how much she misses me. I then applied for her spouse visa (EEA family permit as I am an EEA citizen). She came to UK in December 2016 and then all of a sudden left my house in March 2017. Police came over and told me that she has accused that this was a forced marriage and that I have been raping her during these three months and they told me that she is also saying that she cannot go back to Pakistan due to some honour/safety issue? Police has not charged me yet and have instead given me bail till June to investigate the allegations further and see if they should charge me or not.

So, she has basically fooled me and used me as a ladder to come over to the UK and then disappear. I believe, her goal is to apply for the leave to remain in UK claiming domestic violence and get council house and benefits.

I have informed the marriage curtailment team one month after her leaving the house that the marriage has broken down.

> Does anyone know when will her visa be actually curtailed? From the date she left me in March or from the date they received my declaration in April? Or even later than that?

> I don't have her current address. Will it cause any problems in home office curtailing her visa because they don't know where to send her curtailment letter?

> EEA family permits are issued for 6 months. Will she automatically become illegal in May and will have to leave the country and if she does not leave the country and does not apply for any other visa then?

> Is her police report full of mere allegations going to be enough to claim to be a victim and easily get indefinite leave to remain? What happens if police drops the case with no further action by June? What if police charges me but the court somewhere in the next year says that I am not guilty?

> What I thought was that unless the court confirms that I really am guilty in other words unless I am convicted, she can't get anything? Will she be given an alternate visa to stay in UK till the court decides anything in the next year?


Thanks for your help.

[secret.simon]

I am an EEA citizen

As you are an EEA citizen, the situation is different from that of a British citizen. Marriages of EEA citizens are not subject to the "subsisting marriage" test.

Under EU law, your wife has the absolute right to reside anywhere in the UK until the divorce absolute. There is no requirement that she needs to reside with you, only that she resides in the same country as you. Her legal status derives not from her family permit, but from your marriage certificate. And provided she stays in the UK for five years and you continue to exercise treaty rights, she will automatically acquire PR.

Even if you were to divorce her, provided she has been married to you for three years, with at least one year in the UK, she would automatically have the right to reside in the UK based on RoR.

[in_trouble]

But the following link says something else: https://www.gov.uk/visas-when-you-separ ... ome-office

1. Tell the Home Office
You must tell the Home Office when you divorce or separate from your partner if your visa is based on your relationship. This is done through the Public Statement.

You must then either apply for a new visa or leave the UK.

Your visa is based on your relationship if you have permission to stay in the UK for a limited time as:

a dependant on your partner’s UK visa
a spouse or partner on a ‘family of a settled person’ visa
the partner of a British citizen, EEA national, ‘settled’ person with indefinite leave to remain, or someone with refugee status or humanitarian protection

2. Apply to stay in the UK
If your visa is based on a relationship that’s ended, you must either:

leave the UK
apply for a different visa to stay in the UK





Can you please put some light on that?

[secret.simon]

I think in this context, on that webpage, "partner" means unmarried partner.

The right of an unmarried partner of an EEA citizen would indeed cease on breakup of the relationship, just as it would if the relationship was with a British citizen.

You have done the right thing by notifying the Home Office of the end of the relationship. But under EU law, your wife has rights based on her marriage to you, even if there is no longer a relationship between the two of you. Those rights would only terminate at divorce.

Spouses of EEA citizens are allowed to stay anywhere in the same country as their EEA citizen spouse.

It is long established (since Diatta v Land Berlin [1985] ECR 567) that the separated non-EU spouse of an EU national exercising their free movement rights is entitled to reside in the host Member State even after separation from their spouse provided they both remain in that Member State.

So, she only loses her right to reside in the UK if
a) you are divorced (and then only from the date of the decree absolute).
b) you leave the UK.

[in_trouble]

That's an unbelievable law. I thought it will apply only after she is issued 5 years residence card, which is something that EEA family members have to apply with the help of sponsor/husband upon reaching UK for the 5 years term, of applying for the permanent residence, to start. In case of 6 months eea family permit, one cannot even enter UK again if they leave.

I read somewhere that even an EEA citizen himself can no longer automatically acquire permanent residence unless he applies for it with all the proof that he really has continuously been exercising treaty rights during the last 5 years.

a) Divorce takes a very long time to reach decree absolute, I don't even know her address and if she decides to defend the divorce then it is going to take even longer and there will be a lot of money involved to hire lawyers to attend hearings in that case.

b) How long will I have to leave UK for, in order for her visa to become null and void? Will I have to inform UKBA again about my leaving the UK and that they should cancel her visa?

[secret.simon]

That's an unbelievable law.

It is EU law. It is much more individual based. And it assumes that all people work from the best of motives. And practically everything is a right.

a) Divorce takes a very long time to reach decree absolute, I don't even know her address and if she decides to defend the divorce then it is going to take even longer and there will be a lot of money involved to hire lawyers to attend hearings in that case.

And if the decree absolute takes at least three years, she will have acquired a right to reside in the UK on RoR basis anyway.

b) How long will I have to leave UK for, in order for her visa to become null and void? Will I have to inform UKBA again about my leaving the UK and that they should cancel her visa?

At a guess, at least six months. EU law allows for at least six months in the year for EEA citizens and so logically I would presume that your absence for that period would be discounted. Of course, the problem is that it also resets your clock for PR to zero (unless you have already acquired PR).

If you have acquired PR, perhaps (I am not sure) even your exiting the UK may not affect her right to reside, except after a divorce, by when she will have acquired her own right to reside in the UK.

[in_trouble]

No, I have to apply for the PR in 6 months or so because I came and started working here in Dec2012 and I suppose it can take another 6 months for the PR to arrive. Which means I can only leave UK after 1 year time when I have the PR in my hand. Even in that case, would her visa get cancelled or will it also just get reset?

I read somewhere that even an EEA citizen himself can no longer automatically acquire permanent residence unless he applies for it with all the proof that he really has continuously been exercising treaty rights during the last 5 years.

And for a partner I thought, that 5 years term won't even begin unless the husband/sponsor applies for their 5 years residence card after the family member arrives in UK, that's when the 5 years start getting counted?

The decree absolute has to be issued within 3 years of marriage or within 3 years of her being in the UK? If it is 3 years of marriage then I still have two years to reach decree absolute.

[secret.simon]

The decree absolute has to be issued within 3 years of marriage or within 3 years of her being in the UK? If it is 3 years of marriage then I still have two years to reach decree absolute.

It turns out that I may well have been wrong.

(5) The condition in this paragraph is that the person (“A”)—
(a) ceased to be a family member of a qualified person or an EEA national with a right of permanent residence on the termination of the marriage or civil partnership of A;
(b) was residing in the United Kingdom in accordance with these Regulations at the date of the termination;
(c) satisfies the condition in paragraph (6); and
(d) either—

• (i) prior to the initiation of the proceedings for the termination of the marriage or the civil partnership, the marriage or civil partnership had lasted for at least three years and the parties to the marriage or civil partnership had resided in the United Kingdom for at least one year during its duration;
  ...
  (iv) the continued right of residence in the United Kingdom of A is warranted by particularly difficult circumstances, such as where A or another family member has been a victim of domestic violence whilst the marriage or civil partnership was subsisting.

The three years of marriage requirement is for the initiation of divorce proceedings, not their conclusions. But also see (iv).

Her automatic right to reside in the UK also ceases when you become a British citizen.

[UKBALoveStory]

I married a woman in Pakistan in the last year and came back to UK. .

Do you think, does it make any difference? ( They were married in Pakistan, under Pakistani Law?) so divorce should also be under Pakistan law? I am not sure hence asking.

[secret.simon]

I married a woman in Pakistan in the last year and came back to UK.

Do you think, does it make any difference? ( They were married in Pakistan, under Pakistani Law?) so divorce should also be under Pakistan law? I am not sure hence asking.

I am not knowledgeable enough about family law to answer that question.

My educated guess, and it is just that-a guess, is that if the OP can demonstrate that he is domiciled in England and Wales, he can pursue a divorce through the English courts. Scottish courts may have different rules.

[in_trouble]

(iv) the continued right of residence in the United Kingdom of A is warranted by particularly difficult circumstances, such as where A or another family member has been a victim of domestic violence whilst the marriage or civil partnership was subsisting.

That's what I wrote in the beginning that she will definitely be trying this path. That is the primary reason why she had accused me of all that.

UKBALoveStory wrote:
in_trouble wrote:
I married a woman in Pakistan in the last year and came back to UK.
Do you think, does it make any difference? ( They were married in Pakistan, under Pakistani Law?) so divorce should also be under Pakistan law? I am not sure hence asking

Divorce has to be applied at the place where at least one of the parties is living. If she had gone back then I had the possibility to apply for divorce in Pakistan and it would have been a very easy and cheap process compared to UK. But since she is also here so I must apply for the divorce in UK and so as per the UK laws. However, I'll still give it a try. If somehow I manage to get divorce from Pakistan then I can provide a copy to the home office so that they cancel her visa?

Her automatic right to reside in the UK also ceases when you become a British citizen.

If I apply for UK citizenship after 1 year and it may take another 6-12 months to become citizen, then altogether it can go up to 2 years before her automatic right to reside in the UK will cease. So, I've to live a single life for another few years before I find someone (hopefully) genuine. I am never going to bring anyone from abroad ever again as they just come for council house and UK benefits.

Another thing I wanna share with you is that, an hour or so ago, I have spoken to two different immigration solicitors over the phone and told them about the declaration I have sent to the marriage curtailment team. they both said that her visa will definitely be curtailed and she must leave or apply for some other visa even though I told them that I am European and she is on EEA family permit to join me as a family member.

[Obie]

I know this is a cliche is, as i have said it many time, but i will say the 2 lawyers you spoke to apparently, know nothing of EU or Immigration rules.

[too old]

Moderators could correct if i am wrong, for her to get ROR she would have to had resided at the same address with you in Uk which is not the case here.

[Casa]

Moderators could correct if i am wrong, for her to get ROR she would have to had resided at the same address with you in Uk which is not the case here.

Co-habitation isn't a requirement under EEA Regulations.

[in_trouble]

She will be able to stay if prior to the initiation of the proceedings for the termination of the marriage or the civil partnership, the marriage had lasted for at least three years and the parties to the marriage had resided in the United Kingdom for at least one year during its duration

However, If I apply for the divorce in this coming month (well within the above criteria), she will cease to be my family member on the termination of the marriage. Termination of the marriage here probably means after the decree absolute is issued (can be early next year). Will I then inform the home office by sending them a copy of the decree absolute?

I have read that if there is a child from the relationship and she has either custody or access, then she can apply to stay based upon that.

So, if she is pregnant and if she has not got the abortion, then she may deliver the baby before the end of this year (before decree absolute). Will the child automatically become EEA national without my even knowing. Can she in that case apply to stay using that route?

[secret.simon]

However, If I apply for the divorce in this coming month (well within the above criteria), she will cease to be my family member on the termination of the marriage. Termination of the marriage here probably means after the decree absolute is issued (can be early next year). Will I then inform the home office by sending them a copy of the decree absolute?

I would suggest keeping them involved at all times.

Will the child automatically become EEA national without my even knowing.

That depends on the laws of the specific EEA country involved. Can you let us know which EEA countries are you a national of (list them all)?

For the child to acquire citizenship by descent, she will have to name you as father. There is a presumption in law that the husband of a mother is the father of the child, but that can be contested in court. But you should do so only if you are not actually the father.

I have read that if there is a child from the relationship and she has either custody or access, then she can apply to stay based upon that.

Yes.

[in_trouble]

That depends on the laws of the specific EEA country involved. Can you let us know which EEA countries are you a national of (list them all)?

Dutch only.

For the child to acquire citizenship by descent, she will have to name you as father.

Can she name me as father without my consent?
If we have already separated, how will it be confirmed if that future child really is mine?
The home office and Dutch embassy are going to simply accept what she says without confirming from me?

[secret.simon]

Under Dutch nationality law, the child of a Dutch father is automatically Dutch. So, yes, a child born to your wife is automatically Dutch.

Can she name me as father without my consent? If we have already separated, how will it be confirmed if that future child really is mine?The home office and Dutch embassy are going to simply accept what she says without confirming from me?

There is a rebuttable presumption in law that the husband of a married woman is the father of her children. So, if the child was born while you were married, it is assumed that the child is yours and hence, such a child would be automatically a Dutch citizen.

This forum does not specialise in family law, so I am not aware of how you can prevent her from claiming that the child is yours. There is likely a procedure for requesting DNA testing through the courts, but I am unaware of it.

[in_trouble]

if the child was born while you were married, it is assumed that the child is yours and hence, such a child would be automatically a Dutch citizen.

If I manage to get the divorce before the child is actually born, then?

[Obie]

I found it strange. If the child is yours then surely you will have responsibility towards him or her. Has this fact not sunk in yet.

I accept she may have acted badly, but if there is a child on the way, it changes the whole dynamics.

The child will be Dutch and you got to accept that it will be extremely tough if not impossible to have her removed from the jurisdiction.

[in_trouble]

Obie wrote: I accept she may have acted badly

She has not just acted badly. She has accused me of rape!!! An extremely serious criminal offence!!! and I'm now busy trying to prove that I am innocent by spending so much time, effort and paying thousands of pounds to the lawyers.

Obie wrote: but if there is a child on the way, it changes the whole dynamics.

I have now realized why she was in so much hurry to get pregnant right from the very first day.


So the guidance in this topic for women (specially those living in a third world country) looking for a better life style, weather, free medical treatment, council house and benefits is to find a fool like me and get pregnant. That's all.

[Obie]

Form the bottom of my heart, i do sympathise with your situation, and i am equally frustrated and furious about the treatment you received. However if she lied about you, i believe justice will prevail and you will be vindicated.

I am a believer in the fact that good always prevail over evil.

However i have to review the law, as well as the fact that she may be carrying a child of yours. You obviously cannot force her to have a termination, neither can you in good conscience abandon this child, if indeed he or she is your.

You simply need to make good of a very bad situation.

If the matter goes to court and you are found not guilty, this will weigh heavily against her in terms of the regulation, as she may fall into the UK regulation new definition of marriage of convenience.
If however she employs a good lawyer who knows a thing or two about EU law, something in short supply in the UK at present, then it is the case that she may well succeed, for as long as you are a Qualified person residing in the UK, or an EEA national with a right of Permanent Residence.

[in_trouble]

One of the biggest issue with UK law is that the accuser always has an upper hand and is always in a win win situation. They don't have to spend a single penny on the case, they actually get help and guidance from all those different organizations working in UK towards breaking marriages and making children orphans in the name of independence and freedom. The courts usually say in the their judgement something like following: Because there is not enough evidence found against him to convict him on this occasion so we conclude that he is not guilty. They never say that: Because the accuser is clearly making false allegations to ruin the other person's life for achieving her own personal objectives, that's why we conclude that he is not guilty and we send the accuser to jail.

[Obie]

I am sure the laws are design to protect the most vulnerable and I am sure you will accept that in most or nearly all marital relationship the woman is the weaker party physically and she his most vulnerable to domestic abuse. I know this is not always the case, but in most circumstances it is.

I know injustice do occur. I know a friend of mine whom I happen to meet on this very forum was accused of rape by his wife, with whom he has 2 children. Even though she led him on and invited him to her house , and told him he wants to have their 3rd child. Then she went and lied , but in the end he was exonerated. It was a very painful trial, I accompanied him, and I remember just before the jury came out he was not permitted to leave the court, I had to go and get lunch for him. So I know how painful it can be when some women seek to exploit the system.

Unlike some other culture, in UK and most western culture things are different. It does not follow necessarily because a person is the husband, that they can have sex with a woman without a consent.

I have been to many parts of the world and have very decent friend from different culture. They are not violent and they have similar values and morals to mine. However they have difficulties understanding how on earth they could be prosecuted for exercising their marital rights, as they see it, even without the woman's permission.

I don't think you should class yourself as a fool. What happened to you, if indeed you did not do anything wrong, could happen to anyone. No one is immune to it. I must say it is a rear occurrence, but this is something that happen now and again.

It may well be the case that she was not in agreement to the marriage but her family forced her to, without your knowledge or that of your family, and now she is acting in a rebellious manner.

[in_trouble]

Obie wrote: It may well be the case that she was not in agreement to the marriage but her family forced her to, without your knowledge or that of your family, and now she is acting in a rebellious manner.

Oh yes, police had asked me multiple times during the interview with a lot of stress if it was a forced marriage. I thought that they are blaming me of the forced marriage. So I told them that no it was actually an arranged marriage. I then also gathered some very clear evidence to prove that her claim and the police assumption about me is wrong and shared it with my solicitor. When my solicitor called the police to inform them of the evidence that how happy she pretended to be just so that I arrange her visa and bring her over. Police then simply changed their stance. They are now staying that they are not suggesting it was a forced marriage, they are instead saying that she was happy initially and the sex I had in Pakistan just before her coming to UK was not rape but the one performed after her coming to UK was somehow rape. So, that evidence I gathered has suddenly become completely useless.

However they have difficulties understanding how on earth they could be prosecuted for exercising their marital rights, as they see it, even without the woman's permission.

I think, forcing a wife for sex can never give any satisfaction, contentment, or happiness to the husband and it is also hard to believe husband's getting so desperate for his own wife.
Sex is an integral part of the marital life. If a woman does not want sex then that can easily mean that she is probably not that happy with the relationship and if she is so unhappy that she reports sex as a rape to the police regardless of the fact if it happened or not then she clearly does not want this relationship to continue. This is why In muslim countries and probably in most counties outside Europe, a wife cannot accuse husband of any such thing unless she can prove it with physical damage, injuries or a witness. If she is perfectly fine then it wold make no sense in the law there and she would be suggested to apply for the divorce and leave husband instead of blaming him.