Entrepreneur Visa Refusal

[dnayak]

I need Advice regarding my Entrepreneur Visa Extension.
I applied on 13th Jan 2017 for extension of visa on 12th May they have Refused my Visa stating i didn't create two full time job.
I did provide them with the passport copy of employees, wage slip and Real time full payment submissions.
In total I had 4 employees worked for me
1) Employee A Start date : 01/09/2015 end date 14/10/2016 Hours Claimed : 1620
2) Employee B Start date: 01/01/2016 end date 06/04/2016 Hours Claimed : 479
3) Employee C Start date: 06/04/2016 end date 01/10/2016 Hours Claimed : 792
4) Employee D Start date: 01/06/2016 Still working but on maternity Leave : hours claimed : 948
Now UKBA have came back to me stating that employee B, C, D is fine to claim point but for Employee A they have not awarded me point stating that the real time full payment submission that i have submitted do not include any start date of the employee hence they have omitted all the hours of employee A. But I had letter from Account stating hours worked by each employee and hours claimed for them. Also my solicitor clearly expanied in the cover letter.
can someone advice me what needs to be done to fix the issue. I have been advised for the administrative review for the situation.

[zimba]

There is no such a thing as UKBA any more, it is UKVI or Home Office.
Accountant letter and a covering letter has NO VALUE as they are NOT acceptable evidence under immigration rules. It is very clear that you MUST submit FPS data showing the start date of your employees.

[dnayak]

What Can I do now to fix the issue from my side I submitted Payslips, Passport copy of all employees and Employee paye documents. Can I add documents while I do administrative review

[sm12]

Sorry to hear about this.

An accountant's letter or a solicitor's letter cannot be used in place of a FPS to show start date anymore. Look through the FPS for the month Employee A started working with you to see whether anything was mentioned about his start date.
You can try AR, but if the FPS has no data about start dates, then your best bet is going for a new application within 14 days of your AR result.
You cannot add new documents for the AR, but if this was the only problem with your application, you will probably succeed after making a new application. You should ask your accountant to generate an FPS that includes the start date.

[dnayak]

Should I got through the paper work which I submitted and try to see if there is anything mentioned about the start date of employee A. Also wanted to know if the Adminstrative review is not success full and i decided to make fresh application will this be counted as break in my 10 years settlement as I complete 10 years in Sep 2018.

[inaam.cs]

Sorry to hear about the outcome. Can i ask how did they check hours for other three employees?

[sm12]

Should I got through the paper work which I submitted and try to see if there is anything mentioned about the start date of employee A. Also wanted to know if the Adminstrative review is not success full and i decided to make fresh application will this be counted as break in my 10 years settlement as I complete 10 years in Sep 2018.

Yes, go through your FPS documents to see if there is anything that shows the start date.

After admin review, if you need to reapply, then do so within 14 days of the result. If you make a valid application within 14 days of the result, it will not be seen as a break in your 10 year settlement if your fresh application is approved.

[marcnath]

Seems a bit surprising if all your FPS was generated by the same system. For Employee A, the 1st FPS (Sept 2015) should have the starting date.
So yes, you should double check that and if that is there, then your AR should go through fine.

[Gladiator21]

Apart from submitting FPS report to show start date, can he not submit Starter Checklist form signed by employee as starter checklist has also got starting date of an employee?

[marcnath]

Apart from submitting FPS report to show start date, can he not submit Starter Checklist form signed by employee as starter checklist has also got starting date of an employee?

Nothing stops him from submitting the starter checklist, but there is no point in doing that.
The guidance is quite explicit on this for reporting after 6th October 2013. Only FPS Is accepted for that.

====
2) For reporting from 6 October 2013 onwards printouts of Real Time-Full Payment Submissions which confirm the report of PAYE income tax to HMRC.
This evidence in 1) or 2) above must show the total payments made to the settled workers as well as the tax deducted and date which they started work with the applicant’s business.
======

[dnayak]

I have checked all my FPS Document for
Employee A : He started working with us on 1st September 2015 Till 14th October 2016. But on FPS which we generated there is no start date for Some reason were as it is there for all other employees. I have requested my Accountant to generate New FPS for Employee A. As all other employee have start date and end date of employment. I will apply for administrative review with new Fps document for Jasin Butt but not sure as to they will accept it.
Also have been advised to get P45, P46 AND employment history for employee A.
I really dont know if it will work will try from our end.

[marcnath]

I have checked all my FPS Document for
Employee A : He started working with us on 1st September 2015 Till 14th October 2016. But on FPS which we generated there is no start date for Some reason were as it is there for all other employees.

It is unfortunate that this is the reason for rejection. Unfortunately, the CW was within their rights to reject and the way the AR is set up, the reviewer may have no ability to overrule.

I do not understand why they even need that start date information if it is a new business. The payslips and FPS should meet the needs of having created an employment.

On the other hand, their argument which I can sympathise with, would be that the instructions on this are clear and could have been checked before submission.

On the positive side, a reapplication with the right documents has a very good chance of success.

[dontworry]

Sorry to hear the refusal,

Have you resubmitted the documents?

I am in the same position.

One of my Employee started in June 2013. I don't have any FPS data of him.
Does anyone know. How do I show the proof of starter date?

Please HElp

Kind Regards
R K

[marcnath]

Sorry to hear the refusal,

Have you resubmitted the documents?

I am in the same position.

One of my Employee started in June 2013. I don't have any FPS data of him.
Does anyone know. How do I show the proof of starter date?

Please HElp

Kind Regards
R K

For reporting up to and including 5 October 2013 only:
a) Printouts of Employee Payment Records and, unless the start date of the employment is shown in the Employee Payment Record, an original HMRC form P45 or form P46 (also called a Full Payment Submission) for the settled worker showing the start date of the employment

[f.namxe]

I've only just realised I made this mistake with my submission and looked through all of the FPS I submitted last night to find the start date for one of my employees was on the FPS for the month before she started.
She stated 01/08/2015 but her start date was on the July FPS submitted. I guess this happened because my accountant submits payroll information on the 5th day of the following month
I submitted her FPS from August which is when she started but recalled it didn't have her start date. So I now have to send in the July FPS which has her start date on it.

So sorry it's had this outcome for you but your post actually jogged my memory and made me realise my error.

It is nit-picking and quite pedantic for HO to refuse visas for errors like this when you've obviously got documentation to support 3 other employees but I guess one has to follow the rules to the letter in this case which is a shame for genuine entrepreneurs. From other posts here, you should be fine if you reapply with all of the missing docs and maintain your maintenance funds for 90 days.

All the best!

[marcnath]

I've only just realised I made this mistake with my submission and looked through all of the FPS I submitted last night to find the start date for one of my employees was on the FPS for the month before she started.
She stated 01/08/2015 but her start date was on the July FPS submitted. I guess this happened because my accountant submits payroll information on the 5th day of the following month
I submitted her FPS from August which is when she started but recalled it didn't have her start date. So I now have to send in the July FPS which has her start date on it.

So sorry it's had this outcome for you but your post actually jogged my memory and made me realise my error.

It is nit-picking and quite pedantic for HO to refuse visas for errors like this when you've obviously got documentation to support 3 other employees but I guess one has to follow the rules to the letter in this case which is a shame for genuine entrepreneurs. From other posts here, you should be fine if you reapply with all of the missing docs and maintain your maintenance funds for 90 days.

All the best!

Good luck

[dnayak]

Hi Guys,
Just wanted to update the situation with my case.
I applied for the administrative review which they have not accepted it so have decided to make fresh application but had few query.
1) I paid for IHS charges for the first application which is still not refunded into my account so wanted to know when will I get the refund for the same and also when i place new application do i need to do IHS again. As I am applying with my Wife and daughter.
2) Application was not on 13th Jan 2017 so I submitted all document till end of December 2016 so should i add new RTI and payslip till date. As I have 2 employees now but one is on maternity leave and second works on part time as an when I need him. Will this impact my Application.
3) My Solicitors has asked me to print Current Appointment report Can someone guide me how to do it.
Many Thanks,
Dinesh

[marcnath]

Hi Guys,
Just wanted to update the situation with my case.
I applied for the administrative review which they have not accepted it so have decided to make fresh application but had few query.

Sorry about that but I guess it was expected.

1) I paid for IHS charges for the first application which is still not refunded into my account so wanted to know when will I get the refund for the same and also when i place new application do i need to do IHS again. As I am applying with my Wife and daughter.

I am not sure about this.

2) Application was not on 13th Jan 2017 so I submitted all document till end of December 2016 so should i add new RTI and payslip till date. As I have 2 employees now but one is on maternity leave and second works on part time as an when I need him. Will this impact my Application.

You can use exactly the same employees and period that you used for the first application. Just need to make sure you have the start date. It does not matter what happened since your last application and now.

3) My Solicitors has asked me to print Current Appointment report Can someone guide me how to do it.
Many Thanks,
Dinesh

How did you do that last time ?

You can get it from http://wck2.companieshouse.gov.uk//wcfr ... ompanyInfo

[dnayak]

can Someone please reply on this . Also I wanted to know as the initial application was made on 13th Jan 2017 do we need to make interim account.

[marcnath]

can Someone please reply on this . Also I wanted to know as the initial application was made on 13th Jan 2017 do we need to make interim account.

No, you don't need an interim account. The accounts you submitted earlier is sufficient.

[dnayak]

Thank you for your reply.
I wanted to know should I put additional payslip from Jan 2017 till date or just send the previous ones as I am not claiming any points on the new payslip. Also, the current scenario is that I am the only one working now with the company one of the employee is on maternity leave and another employee works based on workload.
Many thanks,
Dinesh

[marcnath]

Thank you for your reply.
I wanted to know should I put additional payslip from Jan 2017 till date or just send the previous ones as I am not claiming any points on the new payslip. Also, the current scenario is that I am the only one working now with the company one of the employee is on maternity leave and another employee works based on workload.
Many thanks,
Dinesh

You only need to provide the documents for the points you are claiming.
In fact, in this case, it is better to only do that to avoid questions on why the changes

[dnayak]

Hi I need advice I applied fresh application at the same time we send letter to re consider the administrative review now we got letter stating they will re consider the administrative review which can take up to three months also have letter for Biometric for fresh application we made. Don't know if should proceed with fresh application or re consideration of Administrative review.As per my solicitors he is saying its good to do re consideration of AR. If it don't go through then can make fresh application.
Only Point they rejected application was one of the employees didn't have the start date on the RTI.
Please advice
Many Thanks,
Dinesh

[marcnath]

Hi I need advice I applied fresh application at the same time we send letter to re consider the administrative review now we got letter stating they will re consider the administrative review which can take up to three months also have letter for Biometric for fresh application we made. Don't know if should proceed with fresh application or re consideration of Administrative review.As per my solicitors he is saying its good to do re consideration of AR. If it don't go through then can make fresh application.
Only Point they rejected application was one of the employees didn't have the start date on the RTI.
Please advice
Many Thanks,
Dinesh

What was the argument you put forward in the AR ?
When they reject AR the first time, did they give any reasons ?
What does the letter informing you of reconsideration say ? If it has reinstated your original application then proceeding with your fresh application will be considered as a withdrawal of your original application.
To that extent - it makes sense to continue with AR.
I haven't heard of a reconsideration of AR, but you can't have two applications at the same time.
So you/your solicitor should absolutely confirm what the status is with HO directly as to which of the two applications is under consideration and make sure you have a record of the other being withdrawn.