EU & Brexit Deal

[softy monster]

The fifth round of the negotiation between the EU and UK concluded yesterday.

We are closer to agreeing all elements of the rights of EU citizens living in the UK and the reciprocal rights of UK citizens living in the EU – but there is more discussion required.

On key issues, such as the broad framework of residence rights for EU citizens and their family members, social security entitlements and reciprocal healthcare, the UK and EU have largely reached agreement.

On remaining areas, both the UK and EU are focussing on providing certainty for citizens as quickly as possible. Discussions this week have narrowed the focus to the key remaining issues for negotiations.

The UK has also provided further information on its settled status scheme to be introduced next year. It will be streamlined, digital and low cost. As we have said previously, you do not need a document now to prove that you are resident in the UK.

For those who already have EU permanent residence documents the process will be very straightforward, with greatly reduced or zero cost to applicants to update their status under the new scheme.

The talks also explored ways to fulfil the Prime Minister’s commitment to implement the Withdrawal Treaty fully into UK law, ensuring consistent interpretation through UK courts being able to take into account CJEU judgments.
(https://www.gov.uk/government/speeches/ ... and-the-eu)

We want to reach agreement on all areas as soon as we can, providing certainty for citizens.

The EU Council is meeting next week to discuss whether or not there has been sufficient progress in the current talks to move onto discussion of wider issues. Whatever the EU Council’s decision, safeguarding the status of EU citizens in the UK and UK nationals in the EU will remain a priority for the UK. As the Prime Minister said this week, “we want you to stay”.

Our negotiating position continues to be based on the proposal we outlined in June: safeguarding the position of EU citizens in the UK and UK nationals in the EU, with updates provided as the negotiations progress.

[Manchester171]

The conservative party will not reach to any real deal with the EU. They are trying to shift the public opinions to support a second referendum or at least to stay in the EU until the election in 2022. After that, if the Labour party will win the election they will have to deal with the new UK out of Europe with no deal as a feather in the air. They are just wasting time and prolong it as much as they can.

On Sunday, the former Brexit minister David Jones said Britain should be prepared to suspend negotiations at this week’s European Council meeting until the EU was prepared to negotiate further on the financial settlement and begin talks on future trade terms.

Theresa May failing to inform public of 'very serious' threat of no deal Brexit

May and Davis to travel to Brussels for urgent Brexit talks

[Manchester171]

This type of news is confirming what I mentioned above about pushing the public for a second referendum. I believe the EU council have been assured by Mrs May that the two years transitional period are for changing the public opinion.

Reverse Brexit, to avoid the crippling of the British economy.

[Obie]

Then we have David Davis complaining that there will be no transition without a deal first.

This is crazy, brexit is a total utter mess. It is unbelievable how irresponsible a government can be.

We are 17 months away from Brexit, and it is still unclear how things will go.

[rooibos]

I've just received this email. Bold is mine.

Message to EU citizens living in the UK
The Prime Minister
hocommunications@communications.homeoffice.gov.uk
To:
Rooibos
Date:
19 October 2017, 07:08

10 Downing Street



Dear Rooibos


As I travel to Brussels today, I know that many people will be looking to us – the leaders of the 28 nations in the European Union – to demonstrate we are putting people first.

I have been clear throughout this process that citizens’ rights are my first priority. And I know my fellow leaders have the same objective: to safeguard the rights of EU nationals living in the UK and UK nationals living in the EU.

I want to give reassurance that this issue remains a priority, that we are united on the key principles, and that the focus over the weeks to come will be delivering an agreement that works for people here in the UK, and people in the EU.

When we started this process, some accused us of treating EU nationals as bargaining chips. Nothing could have been further from the truth. EU citizens who have made their lives in the UK have made a huge contribution to our country. And we want them and their families to stay. I couldn’t be clearer: EU citizens living lawfully in the UK today will be able to stay.

But this agreement will not only provide certainty about residence, but also healthcare, pensions and other benefits. It will mean that EU citizens who have paid into the UK system – and UK nationals into the system of an EU27 country – can benefit from what they’ve put in. It will enable families who have built their lives together in the EU and UK to stay together. And it will provide guarantees that the rights of those UK nationals currently living in the EU, and EU citizens currently living in the UK will not diverge over time.

What that leaves us with is a small number of important points to finalise. That is to be expected at this point in negotiations. We are in touching distance of agreement. I know both sides will consider each other's proposals for finalising the agreement with an open mind. And with flexibility and creativity on both sides, I am confident that we can conclude discussions on citizens’ rights in the coming weeks.

I know there is real anxiety about how the agreement will be implemented. People are concerned that the process will be complicated and bureaucratic, and will put up hurdles that are difficult to overcome. I want to provide reassurance here too.

We are developing a streamlined digital process for those applying for settled status in the UK in the future. This process will be designed with users in mind, and we will engage with them every step of the way. We will keep the cost as low as possible – no more than the cost of a UK passport. The criteria applied will be simple, transparent and strictly in accordance with the Withdrawal Agreement. People applying will not have to account for every trip they have taken in and out of the UK and will no longer have to demonstrate Comprehensive Sickness Insurance as they currently have to under EU rules. And importantly, for any EU citizen who holds Permanent Residence under the old scheme, there will be a simple process put in place to swap their current status for UK settled status.

To keep development of the system on track, the Government is also setting up a User Group that will include representatives of EU citizens in the UK, and digital, technical and legal experts. This group will meet regularly, ensuring the process is transparent and responds properly to users’ needs. And we recognise that British nationals living in the EU27 will be similarly concerned about potential changes to processes after the UK leaves the EU. We have repeatedly flagged these issues during the negotiations. And we are keen to work closely with EU Member States to ensure their processes are equally streamlined.

We want people to stay and we want families to stay together. We hugely value the contributions that EU nationals make to the economic, social and cultural fabric of the UK. And I know that Member States value equally UK nationals living in their communities. I hope that these reassurances, alongside those made by both the UK and the European Commission last week, will provide further helpful certainty to the four million people who were understandably anxious about what Brexit would mean for their futures.


Yours sincerely

Theresa May, Prime Minister

[softy monster]

I’ve got the same email too, however I’m just wondering if there will be any fees (as mentioned no more than the cost of UK passport) to pay for this simple process or is it going to be free of charge for the swap

“And importantly, for any EU citizen who holds Permanent Residence under the old scheme, there will be a simple process put in place to swap their current status for UK settled status.”

[rooibos]

I’ve got the same email too, however I’m just wondering if there will be any fees (as mentioned no more than the cost of UK passport) to pay for this simple process or is it going to be free of charge for the swap

“And importantly, for any EU citizen who holds Permanent Residence under the old scheme, there will be a simple process put in place to swap their current status for UK settled status.”

I don't think they have a clue. This is just posturing. As long as the Tories are in power there will be no Brexit deal. This is what most of the Tory electorate wants.

[Mugen]

At the moment brp replacement card cost £56, so I think it should cost no more that that and easy 1 page online application.

[softy monster]

At the moment brp replacement card cost £56, so I think it should cost no more that that and easy 1 page online application.

I guess you meant £65!

[Mugen]

At the moment brp replacement card cost £56, so I think it should cost no more that that and easy 1 page online application.

I guess you meant £65!

£65 is a cost of pr application, but according to PM it will be “simple swap”. IMHO it shouldn’t cost more than a price of plastic card with a chip inside and some other small charges to process it. Replace current brp card cost £56 and its maximum what should people pay, who already went through 85 page application and acquired eea pr.
https://www.gov.uk/biometric-residence-permits/replace
But it just me...

[vinny]

Theresa May’s open letter: what she said and what she meant.

[Richard W]

If i understand your point - once you have PR even if divorced you may benefit from the simpler process like an European with PR. However if you only have ROR, you may loose your right to reside.

No, I meant the exact opposite. All the reports and declarations indicate that a retained right of residence will be 'respected' as at present. On the other hand, I see nothing about respecting permanent residence under the EEA Regulations irrespective of how it was obtained.

[Mugen]

Further details on EU Citizens status after Brexit
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... THE_UK.pdf

[rooibos]

Further details on EU Citizens status after Brexit
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... THE_UK.pdf

And comment here:
https://www.freemovement.org.uk/settled ... ns-brexit/

[Manchester171]

Are the non-EU who are the family members of EU, will use the same simple process to apply for PR same as EU citizens?

[bruteforce]

and right when Mrs May started to think things were going her way.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-42217735

[secret.simon]

Despite today’s failure, it looks more likely than ever that a Brexit deal will be done
Perhaps I am cynical, but it is almost as if today was choreographed to strengthen Theresa May’s position - John Rentoul in the Independent.

Also, a thread on Twitter on why things may not be as bad as they seem.

[Obie]

Mrs May looked weak , wobbly and a pathetic excuse for a Prime Minister.

I have always thought Brexit is shipwrecked. Nothing good can every come out it, it will all end in tears.

UK is in a very weak position in these negotiations .

[bruteforce]

I suspect she will just give up & quit at some point, just like Cameron.

[mkhan2525]

May isn't the type of person who will give up power easily. Either she is forced out by her party or the DUP will end up pulling the rug beneath her feet. The latter is still a possibility if the government conceeds to keeping Northern Ireland in the Single Market and Customs Union.

[secret.simon]

I suspect she will just give up & quit at some point, just like Cameron.

I doubt it. There is no alternative (TINA). Assuming that we are Brexiting, nobody on the Leave side is competent enough to take over her role. And somebody on the Remain side would not be trusted.
The constitution of this Parliament means that the DUP hold the balance of power and they will not support Corbyn (due to his IRA sympathies). And Labour will not get rid of him (not for lack of trying). Thus we will have the Conservatives in power for the next few years.
The leading lights in the Conservative Party to be next Prime Minister are Bojo (really??), Jacob Rees-Mogg and Amber Rudd. I thought Amber Rudd has done a pretty good job at the Home Office, but then look at what happened to the previous occupant of that post.
So, really, for the time being, we are stuck with Theresa May.
And I believe that like the Queen, she has a sense of duty to the country (vicar's daughter and all) and will not quit unless there is a clear alternative to take over from her. Unlike mkhan2525, I do not think she is power-hungry and would go if there is a viable (Conservative) alternative.

[Daniann]

What do you think about this ?


https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-brita ... KKBN1E1001

[Manchester171]

I don't understand what do they mean by Britain will guarantee rights for as yet unborn children who join EU parents after Brexit?!

[bruteforce]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-42277040

Anyone else call it a breakthrough deal? I don't. When we get the fine print, I am sure it would be more or less meeting ALL of EU's demands.

[Mugen]

It looks like for 8 years after Brexit or until 2027 it will be no much change.