Is it 180 days or 6months per visit

[n8net]

Hi,

Hope you all are well,

For UK visitor visa, I know one can stay only 6 months in one visit, but is it 6 calendar months or 180 days?

asking because 6 calendar months can be more than 180 days, etc 183.

would love if someone point me to the visa rules that clarify on this.

thanks

[meself2]

It states the duration on your visa sticker (180 days).
Eg this picture found online:

[n8net]

thanks, but what does immigration rules say ?

and what is the consequence of staying 6 calendar months, i.e around 183 days?

[meself2]

thanks, but what does immigration rules say ?

post2122355.html#p2122355

[...] for the purposes of immigration rules, a month is defined as 30 days. So 6 months is 180 days.

and what is the consequence of staying 6 calendar months, i.e around 183 days?

Overstaying and breaching the conditions of their visa, I assume.

[Ticktack]

and what is the consequence of staying 6 calendar months, i.e around 183 days?

Maybe not getting another visa issued. It would easily be found out when next the person applies for visa renewal.

If writing 180 days in black and white doesn't suffice, then we'd also like to learn from it. So we can reference it.

[Casa]

Within a 12 month rolling period, a visitor shouldn't be spending more time in the UK than they are spending in their country of residence. Frequent and successive visits will be flagged as attempting to reside in the UK and are not a genuine visitor.

As you've been made aware in previous posts, the date on your visa vignette are the ones you should comply with, to avoid being refused in future visa applications.

[n8net]

Secondly, for the purposes of immigration rules, a month is defined as 30 days. So 6 months is 180 days.

Hi Simon,

Where does it say so please? because I googled the exact code above and came across this case.
https://www.bailii.org/uk/cases/UKUT/IAC/2021/65.html

While it seems correct that one should adhere to 180 day in the Visa sticker, is that very serious issue staying just couple of days more (as 6 calendar months can be more than 180 days), to warrant refusal when applying again?

[AmazonianX]

Secondly, for the purposes of immigration rules, a month is defined as 30 days. So 6 months is 180 days.

Hi Simon,

Where does it say so please? because I googled the exact code above and came across this case.
https://www.bailii.org/uk/cases/UKUT/IAC/2021/65.html

While it seems correct that one should adhere to 180 day in the Visa sticker, is that very serious issue staying just couple of days more (as 6 calendar months can be more than 180 days), to warrant refusal when applying again?

If what's said before not clear enough and the 180days on visa vignette is not understood you may try it for your person i.e. overstay visa conditions and let's know the outcome of subsequent visa applications and or entry into UK.

[n8net]

Hi all,

thanks for all your replies.

I am not disputing one must adhere to the specification on the visa sticker.

But, just trying to understand the legality of it. because, visa rules for visitors mention only 6 months, not days.

so the question is, for immigration rules, how many days are in a month - as per the case law I pointed earlier, for my untrained eyes, it seems that can be worked out in favour of the applicant as per the judge (albeit that in respect of long residency)

so, I am just questioning where does it say for Visitor rule it is any different.

Also, does this forum aware of anyone encountering negative consequences, just because they overstayed just by couple of days? (but within the 6 month period) ?

also the 180 days, does it inclusive of the landing date ?

[Ticktack]

Hi all,

thanks for all your replies.

I am not disputing one must adhere to the specification on the visa sticker.

But, just trying to understand the legality of it. because, visa rules for visitors mention only 6 months, not days.

so the question is, for immigration rules, how many days are in a month - as per the case law I pointed earlier, for my untrained eyes, it seems that can be worked out in favour of the applicant as per the judge (albeit that in respect of long residency)

so, I am just questioning where does it say for Visitor rule it is any different. There's no visa rule anywhere. You have 3 conditions clearly dictated/stated on a visiting visa. 1. No work 2. No recourse to public funds and 3. Maximum of 180 days stay. Not months. we just use our common sense to tell you that 180 days is 6 months.

Also, does this forum aware of anyone encountering negative consequences, just because they overstayed just by couple of days? (but within the 6 month period) ? I'm sure most people abide by those simple rules. The ones that don't clearly become overstayers and don't even bother going back home. If you knew you want to renew, why tempt fate?

also the 180 days, does it inclusive of the landing date ? It starts from the day you land the UK to the day you leave the UK.

[AmazonianX]

Hi all,

thanks for all your replies.

I am not disputing one must adhere to the specification on the visa sticker.

But, just trying to understand the legality of it. because, visa rules for visitors mention only 6 months, not days.

so the question is, for immigration rules, how many days are in a month - as per the case law I pointed earlier, for my untrained eyes, it seems that can be worked out in favour of the applicant as per the judge (albeit that in respect of long residency)

so, I am just questioning where does it say for Visitor rule it is any different.

Also, does this forum aware of anyone encountering negative consequences, just because they overstayed just by couple of days? (but within the 6 month period) ? Not visitor visa, this case was for a Tier 4 holder who booked flight to return to his home country on last day of visa validity. Unfortunately flight was cancelled, airline rescheduled finally left 4days
after visa expiration. A couple of years later coming for MSc, visa was refused on basis of overstay (considered it harsh as he addressed the matter with correspondence from airline back and forth to reschedule). He was told why not factor in unforseen circumstances and acts of God in his planning? Ended up spending a lot and nearly 2years on AR, appeal FTT before finally getting visa granted by HO.

also the 180 days, does it inclusive of the landing date ?

Further to Ticktacks, with untrained eye, the Vignette specifically mentions duration of 180days, doubt if I can be clearer than that. If looking for technicalities, be ready for the time and money to argue otherwise.

[Frontier Mole]

An interesting point. When is 6 months not 6 months? The answer - when it is for a short term visit visa for 180 days.
The external and internal guidance states “6 months” as the benchmark for visit visas. There is no mention of a period of 180 days.

HOWEVER the overriding rule is the expiry date of any visa. Visit visas are one of the last remaining full duration leave to enter visas still being entered into passports via a vignette. As it states 180 days and the end date reflects that you can argue as to the technicalities but it unlikely to end well and will cost a vast amount to challenge.

The guidance allows for a maximum period of six months so the Home Office is within its protocols to shorten a visit visa to any period below that period. The convention for short term visit visas appears to be it is set to 180 days.

Longer term grants for visit visas 2,5,10 years do not have a stated period of 180 days because they are multi entry visas where the individual is not to spend more than 6 months in any rolling 12 month period in the U.K.

[Frontier Mole]

Edit

Longer term grants for visit visas 2,5,10 years also now have a stated period of 180 days so clearly there is an intention to ensure that an individual does not to spend more than 6 months in any rolling 12 month period in the U.K.

[vinny]

See also There is no 180 day a year rule for visitors to the UK.

Subject to:
Sawmynaden (Family visitors - considerations) Mauritius [2012] UKUT 161 (IAC) (16 April 2012)
Oppong (visitor:length of stay) Ghana [2011] UKUT 431 (IAC) (11 November 2011), concerning Frequency and duration of visits & Frequent or successive visits: how to assess if an applicant is making the UK their main home or place of work or study.

[Frontier Mole]

For longer term visit visas the 6 months in any twelve month rolling period is extant. You can suggest any cases you want but unless they are starred cases they have no force in law.

The caseworker guidance is very clear - if the applicant is spending more time in the U.K. than outside the U.K. it is a significant issue and will likely lead to a refusal either at application or at the point of entry.

[Ticktack]

To buttress the points made above, I have a friend that came to the UK on a 6 months visa. He spent 10 days and left. Because he still had extant visa, he came back 3 months or so later.
The very first question he was asked at POE is "why are you back"?
2nd question/statement, "we're going to discuss what you did the last time you came here, and what you intend to do now"?

Friend: OK!
IO: It's not OK, start talking!

If anyone comes back too soon, within short periods or it shows time spent whilst in the UK was a lot and the individual is back (soon), it's starts the ball rolling.

Every case is obviously different, so is every CW/IO. But I guess they're trained for this.

[Casa]

It would also be wise to consider, is leaving the UK a few days after the visa expiry date really worth the risk ?

[vinny]

For longer term visit visas the 6 months in any twelve month rolling period is extant. You can suggest any cases you want but unless they are starred cases they have no force in law.

The caseworker guidance is very clear - if the applicant is spending more time in the U.K. than outside the U.K. it is a significant issue and will likely lead to a refusal either at application or at the point of entry.

I think the two linked caseworker Guidances reflected the above reported judgments.

Starred cases
The Tribunal’s Practice Directions state that

“Reported determinations of the Tribunal and of the IAT which are “starred” shall be treated by the Tribunal as authoritative in respect of the matter to which the “starring” relates, unless inconsistent with other authority that is binding on the Tribunal.”

There aren’t many of them and they are generally about procedural matters, legal points, definitions etc. They are also likely to change less frequently than country guidance, as those cases depend on events in the country of origin.

Read more in Alison Pickup and Mark Henderson’s Best Practice Guide to Asylum and Human Rights Appeals

Frequency and duration of visits

There is no Rule that states a visitor can only remain in the UK for 6 out of any 12 months, but an ECO must examine the pattern and frequency of visits to see that it does not amount to de facto residence.

Frequent or successive visits: how to assess if an applicant is making the UK their main home or place of work or study

There is no specified maximum period, which an individual can spend in the UK in any period, such as ‘6 months in 12 months’ (as long as each visit does not exceed the maximum period for that visit, normally 6 months). However, if it is clear from an applicant’s travel history that they are seeking to remain in the UK for extended periods or making the UK their home you should refuse their application.

[Frontier Mole]

I think I am getting knicker twisted.
There is a distinct difference between what the guidance states and the operational expectations being applied. The 6 months in a rolling 12 month period I accept is not stated in guidance HOWEVER it is the base calculation that is considered when at the point of entry and in a caseworker decision.

It is legally possible but less than probable that the visit visa route would allow for an individual to have more than six months in the U.K. a rolling 12 month period. The technical point that an individual can have a six month stay, leave and return on another six month visit visa is correct in law. Does it happen, my experience says no. There are always exceptions - the tribunal cases back that up.

Does that mean the door is open to individuals to think is is reasonably available as a method to achieve longer stays in the U.K., in my opinion that sends a false message.