two refusals on EEA4- we don´t understand!

[carferan]

I am Spanish, self-employed and have lived in the UK since 1988 (i.e. 24 years). My civil partner is from Mexico, we became civil partners in London in January 2007. We have applied for his permanent residence via the EEA4 form and have had two refusals. The first refusal´s generic letter from the UKBA stated we had to send more evidence both about his continuous 5-year residence in the UK and of my exercising my EU treaty rights. The second generic letter (not even one personalised line) only said I -the EU national- have failed to provide enough evidence of exercising treaty rights. I have sent: many bank statements covering all years with underlined income entries, new certificates from Inland Revenue, National COntributions Office and COuncil Tax covering all past five years, customer letters, invoices, utility bills, some P60 forms of periods when I have been employed, press cuttings, in total almost 2 kg of documents. I do not employ an accountant, so I have not been able to provide any accountant documents. I own two apartments in London, have no mortgages, rent one out. My civil partner, by European Law, acquires de right to permanent residence automatically. Why all this now? We are both pretty stressed, any advice, please?

[Lucapooka]

He can't apply for permanent residence until he has made five years. Did you provide evidence of the durable relationship prior to your CP.

[Greenie]

He can't apply for permanent residence until he has made five years. Did you provide evidence of the durable relationship prior to your CP.

If they entered into a CP in January 2007 then 5 years has passed.

[carferan]

He can't apply for permanent residence until he has made five years. Did you provide evidence of the durable relationship prior to your CP.

Well, yes, he can, because he has actually resided here for more than 5 years and we have proven it. They are satisfied with that, and in the latest letter they say so. They are not satisfied with the evidence for my exercising my EU treaty rights. I am Spanish, it is me they are not satisfied with!

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

I have sent: many bank statements covering all years with underlined income entries, new certificates from Inland Revenue, National COntributions Office and COuncil Tax covering all past five years, customer letters, invoices, utility bills, some P60 forms of periods when I have been employed, press cuttings, in total almost 2 kg of documents.

You may have simply sent too much information.

I suggest that you reapply with a covering letter explaining your circumstances and include targeted evidence that you qualify. We'll deal with your family member in a moment...

I, EU citizen apply for PR on the basis of residing in accordance with the EEA regulations for five continuous years. I did so on the basis of being self-employed. To demonstrate this, I include the following documentation covering the years 2006 - 2012 (or whatever years you have). To demonstrate my address, I include the following....

Now for partner. My partner, nonEU citizen lived with me at this address for five continuous years. To demonstrate proof of address, I include the following. To demonstrate familiar link, I enclose the following certificate.

If you have any questions or require further evidence, please specify EXACTLY what you require as the generic letters failed to shed light on what was allegedly missing.

[carferan]

thanks. We are thinking of hiring a solicitor as we are really tired of this. I hope it is worth it. Is your advice based on experience? I just don´t know how this forum works and who writes in. Many thanks anyway.

I have sent: many bank statements covering all years with underlined income entries, new certificates from Inland Revenue, National COntributions Office and COuncil Tax covering all past five years, customer letters, invoices, utility bills, some P60 forms of periods when I have been employed, press cuttings, in total almost 2 kg of documents.

You may have simply sent too much information.

I suggest that you reapply with a covering letter explaining your circumstances and include targeted evidence that you qualify. We'll deal with your family member in a moment...

I, EU citizen apply for PR on the basis of residing in accordance with the EEA regulations for five continuous years. I did so on the basis of being self-employed. To demonstrate this, I include the following documentation covering the years 2006 - 2012 (or whatever years you have). To demonstrate my address, I include the following....

Now for partner. My partner, nonEU citizen lived with me at this address for five continuous years. To demonstrate proof of address, I include the following. To demonstrate familiar link, I enclose the following certificate.

If you have any questions or require further evidence, please specify EXACTLY what you require as the generic letters failed to shed light on what was allegedly missing.

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

thanks. We are thinking of hiring a solicitor as we are really tired of this

I can understand that, but unless there is something particular about your application (and I don't think there is), a solicitor will not add much too the process (other than a fee of course).

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

Is your advice based on experience? I just don´t know how this forum works and who writes in.

I can't guarantee success of course, but a well organised covering letter along with targeted evidence will help. The letter should say no more what the bases of the applications are and how they are being evidenced.

Be clear that if they do not believe that satisfactory evidence has been produced you would expect them to state EXACTLY how they have concluded that.

[carferan]

Well, that is what I fear. That we are going to spend 1000 pounds for nothing. I actually sent a covering letter with the previous application. The whole process is unfair: 1) my civil partner has already acquired that right 2) why can´t they write what is it that i am specifically missing in the application 3) they should actually just keep the application in place, give one a few days to send missing documents 4) why can´t one speak to any case worker at the UKBA office? The whole thing is made to exasperate people. Very, very unfair and very unnecessarily so.

thanks. We are thinking of hiring a solicitor as we are really tired of this

I can understand that, but unless there is something particular about your application (and I don't think there is), a solicitor will not add much too the process (other than a fee of course).

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

Well, that is what I fear. That we are going to spend 1000....

Don't do that.

[carferan]

so what do we do? we are both hard working people. My partner has never resorted to any kind of benefits, even when everybody seemed to point that he should. We just work hard, pay all our taxes, and want to keep leading our normal lives in the UK. How can they refuse an application on the grounds that a EU national is not exercising his treaty rights? Beggars belief!

Well, that is what I fear. That we are going to spend 1000....

Don't do that.

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

why can´t they write what is it that i am specifically missing in the application

I tend to agree. Having sent a generic letter it is difficult to understand what the problem is.

If I were to hazard a guess, I would suggest it is the self-employment evidence. Of course there are many ways to demonstrate that one is earning income from self-employment. Without knowing your circumstances, I can't really comment.

If you apply again, give as much details as to what you do and how you are evidencing this. I would have thought the tax information was ample evidence for example.

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

...we are both hard working people....
...We just work hard, pay all our taxes...

Great, just provide or re-provide this evidence.

If you apply and they fail to specify what's missing, you can complain.

[carferan]

I obtained new letters from the Inland Revenue certifying my tax returns had been filed for the last 5 years. I obtained these and enclosed them. I did the same with National Insurance Contributions Office and with Council Tax. I had one certificate per year of all these offices. If the Inland Revenue is happy to issue them, and have never questioned my taxes, why should the UKBA do so? I don´t get it.

[quote="carferan"why can´t they write what is it that i am specifically missing in the application

I tend to agree. Having sent a generic letter it is difficult to understand what the problem is.

If I were to hazard a guess, I would suggest it is the self-employment evidence. Of course there are many ways to demonstrate that one is earning income from self-employment. Without knowing your circumstances, I can't really comment.

If you apply again, give as much details as to what you do and how you are evidencing this. I would have thought the tax information was ample evidence for example.[/quote]

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

This is the address to complain to.

NWCSU@homeoffice.gsi.gov.uk

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

I obtained new letters from the Inland Revenue certifying my tax returns had been filed for the last 5 years.

Looks like this is good evidence to me.

[carferan]

Will that office also deal with our case? I know the office ithat dealt with our case is in Liverpool and we live in London. thanks for taking so much trouble to help us.

I obtained new letters from the Inland Revenue certifying my tax returns had been filed for the last 5 years.

Looks like this is good evidence to me.

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

EEA applications are generally done at Liverpool.

[carferan]

wonderful, thanks!

EEA applications are generally done at Liverpool. I'm looking up something else for you just now, bear with me.

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

If you read this guidance document (page 26), it gives some examples of how one would demonstrate being self-employed. The examples are just that, ie ways to demonstrate. You would not necessarily have to include all of the examples.

If an EEA national claims to be exercising free movement rights as a qualified person in this category, you must check that there is reasonable evidence to support this. For example, proof of registration with HMRC, invoices for work done, a copy of business accounts, an accountant’s letter or other similar documents.

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/sitec ... iew=Binary

[carferan]

Thank you very much for that. It doesn´t really shed any new light on it. I even have a registration certificate which I obtained in Lunar House, Croydon, many years ago. I went with masses of paperwork proving my professional activity and continuous residency. I saw a caseworker and I was granted the registration certificate.

If you read this guidance document (page 26), it gives some examples of how one would demonstrate being self-employed. The examples are just that, ie ways to demonstrate. You would not necessarily have to include all of the examples.

If an EEA national claims to be exercising free movement rights as a qualified person in this category, you must check that there is reasonable evidence to support this. For example, proof of registration with HMRC, invoices for work done, a copy of business accounts, an accountant’s letter or other similar documents.

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/sitec ... iew=Binary

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

It doesn´t really shed any new light on it.

Granted, it doesn't shed any new light, but you can quote the guidance in your cover letter, highlight the relevant page and words and challenge the case worker to state why they can't follow their own guidance document.

Hope this helps.

[carferan]

We are definitely going to file a complaint then. Is a properly written email enough?

It doesn´t really shed any new light on it.

Granted, it doesn't shed any new light, but you can quote the guidance in your cover letter, highlight the relevant page and words and challenge the case worker to state why they can't follow their own guidance document.

Hope this helps.

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

We are definitely going to file a complaint then. Is a properly written email enough?

Absolutely.

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/about ... o-complain

Pick

I am unhappy about the standard of service received from the UK Border Agency (other than in the categories listed above)