Naturalization 15 months after an ILR application

[mbnarayn]

Has anyone applied for Naturalizaion using the below clause which states.

consideration of an application for indefinite leave to remain,
made more than 15 months before the citizenship application,
had been protracted through no fault of the applicant, providing
ILR was eventually granted. This can include applications for
asylum which have resulted in the grant of ILR (you should note
that any asylum cases granted on or after the 30 August 2005
will not result in ILR, applicants will instead be given limited
leave) ; or

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/sitec ... iew=Binary

[Amber]

Post your scenario with a timeline.

[mbnarayn]

Post your scenario with a timeline.

Hi,

Thanks for your time.

I applied for ILR on the 6th of June 2012, got my acknowledgment on the 11th of June 2012 and biometric invite on the 8th of August 2012, submitted biometrics on the 9th of August 2012 and finally received ILR on the 21st of November 2012.

I got the ILR (10 years long residence) after waiting 5 and half months. During this time the UKBA never asked for any additonal information so the delay was never from my side.

I would like to know if i can apply for naturalization next
month during which 15 months would have passed since the date of the ILR application.

[Amber]

I would say no as ILR can normally take up to 6 months so I would expect protracted to be >6 months.

If you're not the spouse or civil partner of a British citizen you should wait at least 12 months after being settled (granted ILR).

[mbnarayn]

I would say no as ILR can normally take up to 6 months so I would expect protracted to be >6 months.

If you're not the spouse or civil partner of a British citizen you should wait at least 12 months after being settled (granted ILR).

Why does the document say 15 months then? Should it not be 18 according to your calculation?

[Amber]

The term protracted is not defined its discretionary, so up to the caseworker. I'm just saying I believe that time over 6 months should be protracted as that's what you're expected to wait until your application is decided.

[John]

Amber, we have already had the g as in 7.5.g quoted above, but not yet quoted is the start of 7.5, namely :-

Discretion to disregard immigration time restrictions in the final 12
months may normally be exercised if:

Given these are part of instructions to staff, "normally be exercised" seems pretty clear to me, given we are talking about a case where the applicant was in no way to blame for the delay in the ILR being granted.

Are we aware of any cases at all where the 7.5.g discretion has not been used?

[mbnarayn]

Discretion to disregard immigration time restrictions in the final 12
months may normally be exercised if:

Given these are part of instructions to staff, "normally be exercised" seems pretty clear to me, given we are talking about a case where the applicant was in no way to blame for the delay in the ILR being granted.

Are we aware of any cases at all where the 7.5.g discretion has not been used?

Thanks John for your reply. I am pretty confident I can apply but the Weybridge NCS service wants me to sign a disclaimer as I have had the ILR for less than 12 months. I don't mind doing this but would like to know if someone has used this option already.

[vinny]

Conversely, are we aware of any cases at all where the 7.5.g discretion has been used?

Are there any reasons why you cannot wait?

[mbnarayn]

Conversely, are we aware of any cases at all where the 7.5.g discretion has been used?

Are there any reasons why you cannot wait?

Hi Thanks for your time. I would like to do it now and get it out of the way.

I was skeptical about sending the originals which is why I wanted to use the NCS, but today I read this on the UKBA website "You may apply directly without using the nationality checking service or a representative. You must submit either original documents, or a fully certified photocopy of your documents."

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/briti ... ngservice/

As this states I can send send certified photocopies I am thinking about getting a Notary Public to certify the photocopies and send it myself.

[Amber]

Well you may be refused and have been forewarned, to me an ILR application is expected to take up to 6 months as stated by the UKBA thus I would see protracted as the ILR application taking longer than 6 months. I will email the caseworker team and see if they have any ideas.

Moreover, 7.5(g) states "made more than 15 months before the citizenship application" it does not state merely made 15 months before.

[vinny]

If the word 'protracted' isn't defined, then your/our assumptions on what it means may be different from theirs.

To be safe, apply on/after 21st November 2013. That is only a few months away. Why risk a refusal?

[mbnarayn]

Well you may be refused and have been forewarned, to me an ILR application is expected to take up to 6 months as stated by the UKBA thus I would see protracted as the ILR application taking longer than 6 months. I will email the caseworker team and see if they have any ideas.

Thank you. That will be really helpful.

[John]

... I am thinking about getting a Notary Public to certify the photocopies ...

I hope not! A Notary Public could be hideously expensive!

Instead use a Commissioner of Oaths at any Solicitors office ... much cheaper .... and just as effective for your purpose.

But take care about not using an NCS office, they do actually check the application for the basics and will decline to send it off if it is not OK. Saving the NCS fee could be an expensive mistake if you send the application direct to Liverpool then it gets rejected.

In particular make sure that you were physically in the UK exactly five years before UKBA will receive the Naturalisation application.

[mbnarayn]

... I am thinking about getting a Notary Public to certify the photocopies ...

I hope not! A Notary Public could be hideously expensive!

Instead use a Commissioner of Oaths at any Solicitors office ... much cheaper .... and just as effective for your purpose.

But take care about not using an NCS office, they do actually check the application for the basics and will decline to send it off if it is not OK. Saving the NCS fee could be an expensive mistake if you send the application direct to Liverpool then it gets rejected.

In particular make sure that you were physically in the UK exactly five years before UKBA will receive the Naturalisation application.

Thanks John for those valuable tips.

[Amber]

I have just received this from one of the nationality caseworkers:

Our service standards, as detailed on our website, states that 95% of postal settlement applications will be decided within six months. Applicants therefore have a legitimate expectation that their application will take 6 months to decide.

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/visas ... tingtimes/

Applications that take longer than this, where the delay was outside of the persons control, will be considered under Chapter 18 Annex B para 7.5 (g) when an application for British citizenship is made.

I hope this now resolves the issue.

[John]

Well no Amber, it just confirms that UKBA would be well advised to change the wording of 7.5.g.

If they really mean 18 months rather than 15 months, they need to say so.

[Amber]

I understand what you are saying John. However, with the specific use of the word protracted (akin to delay), I took it to mean that the ILR case must have been protracted, which would be a delay beyond what is normal, normal at the moment being 6 months. Moreover, it states "made more than 15 months before the citizenship application" therefore, the 15 months can be viewed as a minimum period rather than the actual period. Perhaps when Annex B was drafted, the average waiting period for ILR was 3 months?

[mbnarayn]

Thanks very much everyone for your valuable time. It seems that the UKBA simply wants to put off anyone from taking advantage of 7.5 G. From past experiences with the UKBA i have found it difficult to come across any advisor or case worker who knows the rules inside out.

Some of the posts here have got me thinking about applying now. Previously I was pretty certain the rules in plain English simply meant I can apply now. If I was to be refused I am sure the UKBA would not stand a chance during an appeal but the whole process would take even longer.

I guess not enough people are applying using 7.5 G as the UKBA would probably then have noticed this would have changed the wording from 15 to 18 months.

I must admit this UKBA mindset of taking 6 months to process an application and advertising that as normal is a shame. What happen to the days when the application process was free and took just over 2 weeks to process? I wish each of these caseworkers are made to go through the same process that we do.

[Amber]

Also remeber that there is no appeal process for nationality applications.

[mbnarayn]

The caseworker's interpretation of the rules means a person who has waited 6 months and 2 weeks and would be able to apply for citizenship before a person who waited 5 months for his/her ILR. This does not make any sense and one has to wonder what is going on.

[mbnarayn]

Also remeber that there is no appeal process for nationality applications.

There is a reconsideration process. Not sure if it will help. Although it costs another 80 pounds.

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/briti ... p/appeals/

[Amber]

Yes there is a reconsideration process at a cost of another £80 and they are unlikely to change their minds as you'll be relying on added discretion. Perhaps it's wise just to wait until you've had ILR for 12 months.

[mbnarayn]

Yes there is a reconsideration process at a cost of another £80 and they are unlikely to change their minds as you'll be relying on added discretion. Perhaps it's wise just to wait until you've had ILR for 12 months.

Thanks Amber this seems to be the most sensible approach.

[segs2tier1]

Well, I applied today using the NCS based on the 15 month rule.

The women at the NCS gave me a hard time saying my ILR had not been granted 12 months ago and there is still 4 months to go but I kept referring her to chapter 18, annex B para 7.5g of the BNA and she could not under stand it.

She had to call one of the ''advisors'' of the Home office and say what I was about to do and they were even useless. Some chap on the otherside of the phone kept saying yeah you need 12 months and this and that with no explanation to 7.5g. Basically, I said, can he give me what ever he has said in writing? I got no answer to that..

I told the women you get all sorts of stuff from the HO over the phone but no one is willing to put their reputation on the line by giving you what they have said in writing.

Either way, I sent my application off today and ticked the box that I do not have the 12 month residential requirement because my application was delayed through no fault of my own, took 8 months to come through.

Lets see what happens.

I have bitten the bullet for you all, see if I get through or get refused.