FLR (M) vs EEA2

[Watsona]

Hi all,
I am so glad we found this forum, what a resource. Ok, here goes - I am from the US, living in London for the past 3 years (on student visa and now WP) with my partner who is a national of the Irish Republic. He has been working in the UK for about 4 years.

I am eager to change jobs, so we are researching EEA 2 and FLR. We called the Home Office twice, and both times were told that we can't use FLR as my partner is not a UK citizen. But, we've read elsewhere (including on this Forum) that citizens of the Republic of Ireland are automatically considered to be 'resident' in the UK.

So, we are wondering:

1. are we eligible to apply for either the FLR (m) or EEA 2 and the home office people are just misinformed? Has anyone had success in getting FLR M through an Irish citizen?

2. If we are eligible for either visa, what are the implications, aside from the cost and length of time to process? Would I be eligible to apply for a UK passport more quickly under one route?

3. If we go with EEA2, would I be eligible to change jobs as soon as I receive this letter from the Home Office that we've read about on the forum? This is the main purpose of applying, so if we have to wait the 6 months for EEA 2 then we will be more inclined to push for the FLR M.

Thanks in advance for any help!

[thsths]

Hi Watsona

1. are we eligible to apply for either the FLR (m) or EEA 2 and the home office people are just misinformed? Has anyone had success in getting FLR M through an Irish citizen?

I would think that should be possible, but I may be wrong. It is quite likely that you get a incorrect answer from the Home Office, especially from the call centre. If in doubt, read the law and the guidelines hidden on the BIA web page (of course common law can be pretty hard to read!).

2. If we are eligible for either visa, what are the implications, aside from the cost and length of time to process? Would I be eligible to apply for a UK passport more quickly under one route?

Naturalisation is generally faster via the national immigration path, but the steps are expensive. Under EU law it takes a bit more time (6 years from when you started living together), but everything except the final step is free of charge.

3. If we go with EEA2, would I be eligible to change jobs as soon as I receive this letter from the Home Office that we've read about on the forum?

Yes, that is what the letter says. It may take some convincing, because most employers are not aware of this, but they can call a hot line. You should get the letter about 2 weeks after applying, so I think EEA2 should solve your current problem.

Keep in mind that you cannot change back to the national immigration path once you have used the EU law.

[yankeegirl]

Hi. I'm also an American married to an Irish citizen. You can apply by either route. I myself used EEA route but was advised by the Law Centre we could use either.

As far as citizenship goes, it's quicker if you use the UK immigration route (FLR) if your spouse is a British citizen. Is your partner looking to get British citizenship once he is eligible? If not, I don't think it would make a much of a difference either way.

As far as changing jobs, I would think that you would be able to as soon as you get that letter. The only problem I could forsee is if you are job hunting and the potential employer wants proof of ID and your passport is at the Home Office. You can under the EEA rules request your passport back though and your application will still be processed.

[JAJ]

Hi all,
I am so glad we found this forum, what a resource. Ok, here goes - I am from the US, living in London for the past 3 years (on student visa and now WP) with my partner who is a national of the Irish Republic. He has been working in the UK for about 4 years.

I am eager to change jobs, so we are researching EEA 2 and FLR. We called the Home Office twice, and both times were told that we can't use FLR as my partner is not a UK citizen. But, we've read elsewhere (including on this Forum) that citizens of the Republic of Ireland are automatically considered to be 'resident' in the UK.

So, we are wondering:

1. are we eligible to apply for either the FLR (m) or EEA 2 and the home office people are just misinformed? Has anyone had success in getting FLR M through an Irish citizen?

2. If we are eligible for either visa, what are the implications, aside from the cost and length of time to process? Would I be eligible to apply for a UK passport more quickly under one route?

1. You're eligible for both. See this extract from the Diplomatic Service Procedures (21.4.7):
http://tinyurl.com/2maqsa

"Dual [British/other EEA] nationals, Irish nationals or EEA nationals holding settled status may choose to bring their family members to the UK either on an EEA family permit or via the Immigration Rules.

If the applicants choose to be treated under EC law they should be issued with an EEA family permit free of charge. If they choose to come under the Immigration Rules, they must pay the appropriate entry clearance application fee.

In addition, if the dual national / Irish or EEA national holding settled status chooses to bring his/her family members under EC law, the family members would not be entitled to apply for settled status until they had resided with the Irish / Dual or EEA national in the UK for five years. However, if they choose to come under the Immigration Rules they would be entitled to apply for settled status after two years."

Bear in mind that many people in the Home Office don't understand this, so if applying the UK route, attach a copy of this website extract.


2. Main implication is the length of time to get permanent resident status (ILR).

- Under the UK route, you will be eligible for permanent residence in 2 years, with naturalisation a year later as you will by then have 6 years in total in the UK (3 years temporary, 2 years spouse, 1 year permanent).

- Under the EEA route, you will need to wait 5 years to get permanent resident status, with an extra 1 year for British citizenship, so 9 years in total (3 + 5 + 1).

Does your partner intend to become naturalised British and do you intend to get married or enter a civil partnership? If the answer to both questions is "YES" then the answer for citizenship changes:

- Under the UK route you would still be eligible for permanent resident status in 2 years, but you could immediately apply for naturalisation as the spouse of a British citizen.

- Under the EEA route, you would still have to wait 5 years for settled status (and naturalisation immediately afterwards).

- If your spouse/civil partner is a British citizen, you have an additional option to bypass the need for permanent resident status. As long as you have 3 years legal UK residence and meet the requirements in all other respects, you could use the "ppron method" for naturalisation:
http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewtopic.php?t=15217
http://www.ukresident.com/forums/index. ... opic=37084


One other issue to consider is what happens if the relationship ends before permanent residence. There are more options on an EEA permit, but of course the temporary period lasts longer.

Do you plan to have any children born in the UK?

[Watsona]

Thanks for your responses. It is great to know that we have should have both options and that home office may just be mis-informed! We were in a bit of a panic last week thinking about sending away our passports for up to six months.

We have not made any decisions yet regarding potential citizenship, but since we will most likely be here for two-three years anyway it seems we should keep that door open and fork over the cash for the FLR route. If I did get UK citizenship we could then easily move to Ireland at any time without going through this hassle again.

I will certainly quote that regulation re: irish nationals in my application.

[thsths]

We were in a bit of a panic last week thinking about sending away our passports for up to six months.

They like to scare you with that, but it is actually not true. You can ask for the passports to be sent back, which should only take about a week. This does not affect the status of your application (although the Home Office web page states otherwise, they will confirm this if you ask them). Obviously you will eventually need to send your passport in again, because the Residence Card is issued as a sticker in the passport, but that should take long either.

[JAJ]

We were in a bit of a panic last week thinking about sending away our passports for up to six months.

They like to scare you with that, but it is actually not true. You can ask for the passports to be sent back, which should only take about a week. This does not affect the status of your application (although the Home Office web page states otherwise, they will confirm this if you ask them).

This is true for an application made under EEA rules, but is not true for an application made under UK rules. However, UK-rules applications are generally processed more quickly and a personal service is available for a higher fee.

[JAJ]

Thanks for your responses. It is great to know that we have should have both options and that home office may just be mis-informed! We were in a bit of a panic last week thinking about sending away our passports for up to six months.

We have not made any decisions yet regarding potential citizenship, but since we will most likely be here for two-three years anyway it seems we should keep that door open and fork over the cash for the FLR route. If I did get UK citizenship we could then easily move to Ireland at any time without going through this hassle again.

Note the points made already about your pathway to citizenship being shorter if you are legally married (or in civil partnership) and your Irish partner chooses to become naturalised British. If he or she has been in the UK for 4 years, then eligibility for naturalisation will occur in a year's time.

[thsths]

(returning your passport)

This is true for an application made under EEA rules, but is not true for an application made under UK rules. However, UK-rules applications are generally processed more quickly and a personal service is available for a higher fee.

Of course you are right. I was referring to the EEA rules, because Watsona was worried about the 6 month duration.

I still think it is a bizarre move to "confiscate" your passport for the duration of the application, but it does seem to be the law. I wonder if you can just get a second passport in the mean time?

[JAJ]

(returning your passport)
I still think it is a bizarre move to "confiscate" your passport for the duration of the application, but it does seem to be the law.

For UK-rules immigration applications, yes. However it's not the case for naturalisation.

I wonder if you can just get a second passport in the mean time?

If the other country will do so - yes. However if your existing leave to remain is stamped on the passport with the Home Office then travel might be difficult in any case. Also, in some circumstances, leaving the UK may constitute an abandonment of the in-country immigration application.