help: EU nationals in Ireland and dependent non-EU parent

[notrouble]

Hey guys,

A friend (an EU national married to a non-EU girl) lives in Ireland for a number of years, and has a good, full time job. His wife is a non-EU national who has an EUFAM stamp in Ireland. They have an EU national baby.

This EU national has been supporting his non-EU mother-in-law for about a year and a half. The non-EU mother lives alone in her home country, has no other children, has no job, and depends financially on her daughter's EU husband.

They have sent her about 5-7 thousand euros over each year in regular bank transfers. They have also been handling out cash, but obviously there are no records to prove this.

The couple applied to bring this dependent relative to Ireland. In the letter accompanying their application, they indicated that they were applying under the EU Directive, and that the mother was in fact dependent on them and attached the proof confirming transferring money over the last 1.5 years.

Several weeks later, the embassy rejected the application. In the rejection letter, the embassy says that the non-EU mother-in-law has not provided any documentation proving that she depends on her daughter's family, i.e. she did not provide any documents showing how much money she spends on her bills, accommodation, food, etc., and that she did not provide copies of her bank statements.

I need to point out that the embassy did not ask for any additional documents. In fact, when the couple contacted the embassy and asked if they needed any further documents, the embassy staff responded saying there no further documents were required.

This is where I would like to ask for your advice. I feel the rejection is purely opportunistic, and is against the EU Directive on free movement. From where I stand, I see the family has to help that woman, who in her own country is unable to find a job (she is in her late 50s) and obviously requires her daughter's help. Should not have the embassy asked them first to submit any further documents before rejecting the application?

Second, the embassy did not allow a visa application for a dependent parent without the visa fee. So the couple had to pay it up too. It is my understanding that this is not in line with the existing EU Directive and the Irish transposition.

Next, do you think submitting an appeal will do any good? Is there a way to submit it directly in Dublin or do they have to go through the embassy again?

I have advised them submitting a complaint via SOLVIT as soon as possible.
From your experience, how long should it take?

Thank you!

[Brigid from Ireland]

One point - is the baby entitled to Irish citizenship? If the child was born in Ireland and the parents lived here for three years prior to the birth, then the baby is an Irish citizen, and you simply apply for an Irish passport in the usual manner (with p60 for three years prior to birth and the birth cert to show entitlement to Irish citizenship).

If yes, I would suggest getting an Irish passport for the baby, as I think that this may help the case.

[Latintraveller]

Just as a postscript to this. If the EU national is British there is no three year residency requirement.
http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/mo ... scent.html
http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/2004/en/ ... print.html

[notrouble]

One point - is the baby entitled to Irish citizenship? If the child was born in Ireland and the parents lived here for three years prior to the birth, then the baby is an Irish citizen, and you simply apply for an Irish passport in the usual manner (with p60 for three years prior to birth and the birth cert to show entitlement to Irish citizenship).

If yes, I would suggest getting an Irish passport for the baby, as I think that this may help the case.

Sorry, I think I have confused you. The problem is with bringing a dependent mother-in-law, and not with my child.

[notrouble]

Just as a postscript to this. If the EU national is British there is no three year residency requirement.
http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/mo ... scent.html
http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/2004/en/ ... print.html

The same problem is here. The question is how to deal with the Irish immigration authorities that are acting as if there is no EU Directive!

[Brigid from Ireland]

The case of the grandmother is stronger if she is the parent or grandparent of an EU/Irish citizen. That is why it is recommended that you get Irish or EU citizenship (preferably Irish) for the baby. It gives the grandmother a blood link to an EU citizen.

[notrouble]

The case of the grandmother is stronger if she is the parent or grandparent of an EU/Irish citizen. That is why it is recommended that you get Irish or EU citizenship (preferably Irish) for the baby. It gives the grandmother a blood link to an EU citizen.

The baby and its father are both EU nationals who exercised their freedom of movement right. Nevertheless, the Irish authorities are denying the right of joining a dependant non-EU relative. This is where I need some advice...

[jinkazama_11]

Irish embassy in which country?

[notrouble]

Irish embassy in which country?

In Russia.

[New App]

There seems to be serious confusion about EU TREATY RIGHTS.

It applies to the EU Citizens

(i) spouse
(ii) partner
(iii) children of both sides who are under 18

It doesn't apply to THE PARENTS of the the non eu or eu citizen.

If the parents what to reside as dependents you must apply for a dependent visa. You must show you have funds to support yourself your direct family and also your parents in law. For dependents a you should have about €20k per dependent this number is not exact but it's a guide.

[jinkazama_11]

There seems to be serious confusion about EU TREATY RIGHTS.
It applies to the EU Citizens
(i) spouse
(ii) partner
(iii) children of both sides who are under 18
It doesn't apply to THE PARENTS of the the non eu or eu citizen.
If the parents what to reside as dependents you must apply for a dependent visa. You must show you have funds to support yourself your direct family and also your parents in law. For dependents a you should have about €20k per dependent this number is not exact but it's a guide.

you are wrong. it does apply to parents.

[notrouble]

Yes, I second this.

The directive, as well as the Irish transposition of it, both include parents (and other relatives in the ascending line) as direct beneficiaries of this regulations.

[Alks]

Hi notrouble,

Did you get the VISA issue sorted?

Thanks
Alks

[notrouble]

I decided to post an update on this particular case.

A complaint was submitted through the contact point of SOLVIT in one of the Eastern European EU countries (one of the ones that joined the Union in 2004). Their response was absolutely useless and in fact, they even discouraged my friends from bringing their mother to Ireland, implying that there are no right to bring her to join them in Ireland. What a load of bs...

Anyway, the couple put together an appeal letter asking the embassy to reconsider the negative decision. The letter spelled out why the mother needed to join the couple in Ireland and so on. It included all possible references to the EU Directive as well as the document transposing it into the Irish law.

Finally, after about a month, they got a positive resolution as a result of this appeal. The mother was issued with a visa to move to Ireland. I understand that the embassy still charged a fee (which it should not have). I did encourage them to ask the embassy to reimburse/refund the fee, but I think the couple were too tired to fight this Irish bureaucratic machine and were effectively happy with the outcome.

[arz1986]

How much time did it take to process appeal, I appeal to my EU1 dependent parent case 15 days ago in ireland.